http://www.turbododge.com/forums/ Improving the intake tract - air filter to intake valve en Fri, 20 Nov 2009 22:19:14 GMT vBulletin 60 http://www.turbododge.com/forums/images_td/misc/rss.jpg http://www.turbododge.com/forums/ http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/318117-tbi-cam-timing-timing-belt-misalignment.html Thu, 19 Nov 2009 15:32:58 GMT OK just got my head on the block and ready to fire up. BUT two questions. One- the cam rotates just fine assembled. the cam in it is a 2.5 TBI which has more retard ground in it that the 2.2 tbi. Should my cam be advanced to bring my timing up to the stock 2.2 tbi spec? I have the adjustable cam... OK just got my head on the block and ready to fire up. BUT two questions.

One- the cam rotates just fine assembled. the cam in it is a 2.5 TBI which has more retard ground in it that the 2.2 tbi. Should my cam be advanced to bring my timing up to the stock 2.2 tbi spec? I have the adjustable cam gears so no big deal.

Second- I have a new timing belt, tensioner, and an adjustable cam gear on it. When i turn it over, the timing belt wanders to the outside of the cam sprocket. I end up with sprocket visible on the Valve cover side, and none on the mount side. Any Ideas of what could be causing this? I'm not sure what could be misaligned if anything. is the adjustable gear on the cam just too far in for some reason? most of my other TDs havent tracked down the center either but Idk, this one bothers me. ]]> Engine - Induction Buckracer http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/318117-tbi-cam-timing-timing-belt-misalignment.html http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/318025-cold-air-intake-please-help.html Wed, 18 Nov 2009 16:16:35 GMT I have a 1989 dodge daytona shelby 2.2L.. im tryin 2 install a Cold air intake but i do not kno where 2 start. If someone could point me to the right direction. somewhere that would have a diagram or a decent walkthrough.. im not very mechanically smart, but hopefully someone can help me I have a 1989 dodge daytona shelby 2.2L.. im tryin 2 install a Cold air intake but i do not kno where 2 start. If someone could point me to the right direction. somewhere that would have a diagram or a decent walkthrough.. im not very mechanically smart, but hopefully someone can help me ]]> Engine - Induction Guzman4586 http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/318025-cold-air-intake-please-help.html http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/318014-intercooler-log-manni.html Wed, 18 Nov 2009 05:45:45 GMT I have a 1985 turbo z and was thinking of intercooling the engine, anyone have any idea on how i would redo the vacuum lines if i was to put a bov on the intake pipe. I have a 1985 turbo z and was thinking of intercooling the engine, anyone have any idea on how i would redo the vacuum lines if i was to put a bov on the intake pipe. ]]> Engine - Induction catch23.5 http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/318014-intercooler-log-manni.html http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/317984-dual-core-ic-anygood.html Wed, 18 Nov 2009 03:06:23 GMT Hey guys, just picked up a dual stock core intercooler for a good price and figured I'd try it out.. Anyone have experience with these? How well do they flow and cool over a stocker? ]]> Engine - Induction 1984Rampage http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/317984-dual-core-ic-anygood.html http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/317866-intercooler-pipe-velocity.html Mon, 16 Nov 2009 20:06:45 GMT Information was from VWVortex from a member over in Europe. I found it interesting so I figured I would share it with you guys. He claims the formulas were taken from his Mechanical Engineering text book. The formula: Velocity = (CFM/Area of piping) Where X= CFM , V=Velocity , Y=Pipe Diameter... Information was from VWVortex from a member over in Europe. I found it interesting so I figured I would share it with you guys. He claims the formulas were taken from his Mechanical Engineering text book.

The formula: Velocity = (CFM/Area of piping)
Where X= CFM , V=Velocity , Y=Pipe Diameter

V= (X / 60)/ Pi (((Y/12) /2) ^2)

Just to explain... I changed some values for simplicity in the formula. 60 is time. Before he had it V= (X^3/min x 1 min/60s) .

I set a constant on both sides of his formula; such as intercooler pipe diameter is represented as one constant value... Ex. 2.5" pipe ID will be the divider of the CFM. 2.5" ID is represented as .03406. It's just how the formula works out so it's now easier to understand. The same with CFM values. 450 CFM = 7.5 .

Before I go any further, these are all estimated numbers based on a conservative value of 1.5 to go from BHP to CFM. Some use 1.2 others 1.7 depending on engine type. Not sure what ours would be.

The original poster claims that ideal air flow speed without encountering too much restriction, friction, heat, and such and providing the quickest speed is Mach .4 (1128 ft/s) or otherwise 451.2 ft/s.

Here's the chart.

2” I.D. PIPE

450 CFM ...344.04 FT/S
750 CFM ...573.39 FT/S
1200 CFM...917.43 FT/S
1800 CFM...1376.15 FT/S
590.17 CFM = 451.2 FT/S

2.25” I.D. PIPE

450 CFM ...260.96 FT/S
750 CFM ...453.06 FT/S
1200 CFM...724.9 FT/S
1800 CFM...1087.35 FT/S
746.92 CFM = 451.2 FT/S

2.5” I.D. PIPE

450 CFM ...220.19 FT/S
750 CFM ...366.99 FT/S
1200 CFM...586.7 FT/S
1800 CFM...880.79 FT/S
922.07 CFM = 451.2 FT/S

2.75” I.D. PIPE

450 CFM ...181.95 FT/S
750 CFM ...303.25 FT/S
1200 CFM...484.8 FT/S
1800 CFM...727.8 FT/S
1115.91 CFM = 451.2 FT/S

3” I.D. PIPE

450 CFM ...152.87 FT/S
750 CFM ...254.79 FT/S
1200 CFM...407.4 FT/S
1800 CFM...611.5 FT/S
1328.15 CFM = 451.2 FT/S

4” I.D. PIPE

450 CFM ...85.99 FT/S
750 CFM ...143.32 FT/S
1200 CFM...229.31 FT/S
1800 CFM...343.96 FT/S
1574.15 CFM = 451.2 FT/S

In blue are the idealistic CFM flow rates per pipe diameter. Remember, we want the speed at 451.2 Ft per Second.

Here are some quick values for those who are lazy.

450 CFM=7.5
750 CFM=12.5
1200 CFM=20
1800 CFM=30

2.0” ID PIPE=.0218
2.25” ID PIPE=.02759
2.50” ID PIPE=.03406
2.75” ID PIPE=.04122
3.0” ID PIPE=.04906
4.0” ID PIPE=.08722 ]]> Engine - Induction Dave http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/317866-intercooler-pipe-velocity.html http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/317793-can-782-head-valve-guides-replaced.html Sun, 15 Nov 2009 22:13:55 GMT The FSM indicates that if the valve guides need to be replaced, junk the head and buy a new one...but it's easy to find replacement valve guides. Some of the guides are also oversized requiring the head to be drilled for installation. Other references I find indicate heating the head to 300+ degrees is required to be able to push/press them out.

I'd sure like to get some comments from someone that has actually done it.

I have a good (AFAIK) 782 I plan to put on a new shortblock I am building. Before I just purchase a new casting or a rebuilt one, I'd like to know if rebuilding this one mysolf makes any sense at all.

I'll have to go for a good 3-5 angle valve job but the rest I should be able to handle. ]]> Engine - Induction ILIKESHELBYS http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/317793-can-782-head-valve-guides-replaced.html http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/317688-ported-8v-head-onditty-progress-shelby.html Sat, 14 Nov 2009 10:08:16 GMT Ondonti was up working on his car, and mine. We decided it needed a quick Great depression racing port job on my daily driver that we were replacing pistons on. There was an assembly error when putting the motor together before I bought it, and the rings were put in wrong. Cast ring was put in the... Ondonti was up working on his car, and mine. We decided it needed a quick Great depression racing port job on my daily driver that we were replacing pistons on. There was an assembly error when putting the motor together before I bought it, and the rings were put in wrong. Cast ring was put in the top spot, chrome ring on the bottom. This cause the rings to totally fail. lol

Ring bits from the other pistons. There was actually 2 cracked pistons from the rings being in wrong.

As we took the pistons out, the rings just fell totally apart.


I also decided to upgrage the stock wastegate since it was the small one and was not holding.

I also decided to try a spring mod that worked really well on my rt with the stock turbo.


While I was doing this, onditty was busy porting. :D

Crappy stock intake port

Stock bowl.


Onditty at work


AFTER.....

intake

Exhaust

Finished, head not cleaned.

Pic of finished head and piles of removed material. lol


And, pistons in. :D, with file fit rings.


This car should be a wicked fun daily driver on lowish boost. Planning on running 14-15psi on my stage 3 cal. Eventually, the shelby will get my custom downpipe off the RT

And either my rebuilt holset from the rt or a 20g mistu turbo. ]]> Engine - Induction bansheenut420 http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/317688-ported-8v-head-onditty-progress-shelby.html http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/317650-calculating-ic-plumbing-losses-2-vs.html Fri, 13 Nov 2009 19:13:38 GMT a frequent question is 'what size IC plumbing should I run?'

besides bling, there *is* a performance impact, since the larger IC plumbing has lower flow velocity, and therefore lower friction flow losses.

but how to quantify ? fluid mechanics, argh...
there will be 'major losses' (due to the length of ducting)
and 'minor losses' (due to elbows and connectors)

for major losses, see, e.g. :
D'Arcy-Weisbach Equation for Pressure and Head Loss

assumptions:
2.2L, 6250 rpm, 14.0 psi, 85% VE
flowrate = 2.2 * 6250/2 * (1+ 14.0/14.7) * 85% = 11409 Lpm = .19 m^3/s
(this is a relatively crude method of calculating flowrate; anyone got a better idea?)

the tough part is to find the friction coefficient (f) ;
assuming a dynamic viscosity of 1.79E-5 N sec/m^2
and a duct roughness of 0.2mm (pretty smooth), 2m duct lenght, 80C air; from the moody diagram:
for a 2" pipe: Re = 266255, and roughness ratio .0004, f = ~0.019
for a 3" pipe: Re = 177503, and roughness ratio .0003, f = ~0.019
for a 4" pipe: Re = 133127, and roughness ratio .0002, f = ~0.019

for minor losses, see e.g. :
Minor Loss in Pipe or Duct Components
Assume a well constructed IC install with 3 90s, 3 45s, couple connectors,
for a TOTAL minor loss coefficient of 2.0.

major loss + minor loss = total loss

for a 2" pipe, flow velocity = 93.8 m/s: 3292 + 8802 = 12094 Pa = ~1.7 psi
for a 2.5" pipe, flow velocity = 60.0 m/s: 1079 + 3605 = 4684 Pa = ~0.7 psi
for a 3" pipe: flow velocity = 41.7 m/s: 434 + 1739 = 2172 Pa = ~0.3 psi
for a 4" pipe: flow velocity = 23.5 m/s: 103 + 550 = 653 Pa = ~0.1 psi

I would appreciate if someone wanted to doublecheck my Excel spreadsheet, or if anyone wants a copy to play with PM me.

I will post a similar thread in the Exhaust section, comparing exhaust losses. ]]> Engine - Induction detobias http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/317650-calculating-ic-plumbing-losses-2-vs.html http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/317576-ic-piping.html Thu, 12 Nov 2009 21:45:45 GMT hey guys i'm finishing up my two year project shelby tona, and the last little bit i have to do is run my own I.C. piping for my FMIC i got, where did everybody else get your piping? what's a good resource for it? looking for 3''.. ]]> Engine - Induction lancerman23 http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/317576-ic-piping.html http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/317484-diamante-intake-3-0-lebaron.html Wed, 11 Nov 2009 20:02:35 GMT does anyone know what it would take to install a diamante intake on a 3.0 lebaron or if it is even possible?? and what gains would you see with a mild ported upper and lower?? does anyone know what it would take to install a diamante intake on a 3.0 lebaron or if it is even possible?? and what gains would you see with a mild ported upper and lower?? ]]> Engine - Induction nimoryan http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f17/317484-diamante-intake-3-0-lebaron.html