Cloud Car - SRT4 Conversion

[PeteGLH]

Hi all!

Here's the deal, I'm looking at putting together a new project. Having owned a few classic 8V 2.5 Turbo I TD's (2 Omnis, 1 Mini) I'm now looking into owning a bigger and more comfortable Turbo Dodge. I am currently looking at the possibility of getting a cloud car (Stratus/Breeze) and swapping a 2.4 Turbo out of a wrecked SRT-4 into it. I love having sleepers and a Cloud car is something that I would like to work on!

I have a few issues and quick questions that I would need answers to. I've looked around the forum and found alot of info on swapping the internals into the 2.4 and adapting a turbo setup, but that is not the route that I want to walk down...

Here's the deal, I am currently looking for a 5 spd Stratus. Up here in Canada, 5 spds are only available with the 2.0L engine. If I was to swap a srt-4 engine would engine mounts line up?? Would it be like swapping into a 1st gen Neon?? Axles? What am I looking at here?

As far as electronics, starting off with a wrecked SRT-4 I would be running complete 2004-2005 electronics so that wouldn't be too much of a hassle except for the joy of cutting and splicing but that nightmare doesn't worry me too much... Fuel Delivery would be either SRT-4 fuel pump or 255lph Walbro unit.

Is there any clearance issues with the turbo behind there? Firewall? Has this ever even been done? I'm usually quite successfull at finding information about cars and swaps, but I can't seem to find much on Cloud Cars from 2.0L to 2.4T SRT-4.

Only reason I want to go from 2.0 to 2.4 Turbo is that the 2.0L come with 5 speeds and are much cheaper to buy than 2.4's with automatics. Plus, all the stuff (pedals, console, shifter, cables) are already there for a 5spd 2.4 Turbo setup.

Another option I was looking at is taking a 2.4 Auto car, swapping to 2.4 Turbo, and finding all the accesories for a auto to manual conversion. However 5spd Cloud Cars are hard to find around here. Would Neon pedals and shifter "bolt in" easily into a cloud car?

If Neon shifter, pedals, accesories easily swap into the cloud car, and if the motor bolts in easier into a 2.4L Stratus, maybe I would consider going that route as well. However I'd doubt that there'd be any difference in the frame for a 2.0 or 2.4 Cloud car...

Anyway, I'm a little out in the dark here... Never really looked into the possibility of swapping 2.4T into a cloud car, but I love the idea and it could turn into a relatively awesome project.

Late 80's clean Shadows and Mini's are hard to find around my neck of the woods which is why I'm a little fed up of playing with 2.2's and 2.5's...and I think a cloud car would be the perfect project to get me back behind the wheel of a new TD!

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks to all!

[glht86]

http://www.stratusphere.net/forums/C...rl-t35195.html
check that out it should answer all of your questions and that site is awesome for cloud cars. I'm kinda into them to but can't afford it right now. Good luck with your project though.

Jay

[88-16V-Lebaron]

I was looking into doing the same thing with a Sebring convertible (of the same year even) and the problem is the skim and key need to be in constant communication witht the computer to avoid shutdown. You are missing 2/3 in your scenario.

[PeteGLH]

Hmm, more brainpower needed than what I thought...

Might go another way, 2.4 N/A with 2.5 Turbo I internals, custom manifold, turbo and standalone....I wouldn't have thought the electronics off the SRT-4 to be that much of a hassle...

What about running 2.4T with good old 2.2 or 2.5 Turbo Electronics? Might sound possible and perhaps easier to fool around with? Any comments?

Next point, I'm wondering what manual tranny would easily bolt up to the 2.4L. I've seen a topic around about one guy fitting a A-568 to the 2.4L, which would mean that a standard 523 or 555 should fit in place except for that one missing bolt that doesn't seem to align...

I absolutely want to convert to a 5spd car, and if a could use parts laying around my garage to get going I would be much happy!

Keep 'em coming...

Thanks to all!

[TurboShadowES]

why not swap in a 2.4t from srt 4 into the cloud car, run it on a cloud car 2.4 comp, and then use somthing like the hahn portfuler for fuel?

[PeteGLH]

I guess it would also be an option, however I'm a little concerned with timing issues. Apparently as boost kicks in, timing is retarded by the ECU in turbo applications. I don't believe 2.4 N/A Comps are equipped with such features. I assume you would have to run a standalone as well to prevent knock at higher boost levels... I think it would be much cheaper for me to run 2.2 or 2.5 Electronics which I have laying around in the garage if possible. I've seen a few Old TD's with 2.4's running 2.2 or 2.5 electronics so... I guess it could work out...

[Casper]

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeteGLH Might go another way, 2.4 N/A with 2.5 Turbo I internals, custom manifold, turbo and standalone....I wouldn't have thought the electronics off the SRT-4 to be that much of a hassle...

May end up being the easiest way to go. There are some people out there who are selling log manifolds to bolt to that head, so it should not be too hard to find something to work.

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeteGLH What about running 2.4T with good old 2.2 or 2.5 Turbo Electronics? Might sound possible and perhaps easier to fool around with? Any comments?

IIRC, the cloud cars run on SBECII, so there is some basic level of compatibility, but how much, someone else would have to answer.

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeteGLH Next point, I'm wondering what manual tranny would easily bolt up to the 2.4L. I've seen a topic around about one guy fitting a A-568 to the 2.4L, which would mean that a standard 523 or 555 should fit in place except for that one missing bolt that doesn't seem to align...

Also remember that he bolted an A-568 to a 2.4L that was installed in a TD, so installing the starter on the backside of the engine was not a problem. In a car in which a 2.4L is normally installed, the starter wiring will be on the front side. It shouldn't be that difficult to re-wire it, but I'm not sure if there are other issues to consider. Like for instance your plan to be hanging a turbo off the back of the engine too...

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeteGLH I absolutely want to convert to a 5spd car, and if a could use parts laying around my garage to get going I would be much happy!

The 5-spds used in the cloud cars are the same ones used in 500hp turbocharged first-gen neons, so if you have the stock one rebuilt and take care of it, there's no reason it won't work for you.

[Casper]

Quote:

Originally Posted by PeteGLH I think it would be much cheaper for me to run 2.2 or 2.5 Electronics which I have laying around in the garage if possible. I've seen a few Old TD's with 2.4's running 2.2 or 2.5 electronics so... I guess it could work out...

Check w/the D-Cal and Chem groups to see if anyone has cracked the SBECII. If so, then you might be able to get the cloud car SBECII socketed and have a cal developed for it.

[banger68]

This would be a neat car when done. Good luck.

[PeteGLH]

Thanks

I've got a sweet deal on a '96 2.4 Caravan with an A413... might go that way as well. I need a Van for my company, and I want a TD. Old Vans don't look too serious, but a 96-00 Van can be made to be a very nice car.

Anyways, I will keep you posted... I wan't to build something that is kinda out of the ordinary Right now seems to be either a Van or Stratus, 2.4L with probably a Megasquirt setup ...

Anyways, thanks for all your help, any more comments are welcome!!

[jbarlow]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TurboShadowES why not swap in a 2.4t from srt 4 into the cloud car, run it on a cloud car 2.4 comp, and then use somthing like the hahn portfuler for fuel?

The engines are not exactly the same, even outside...so a direct swap is not necessarily direct.

Easiest IMHO...swap in SRT4 rods+pistons (cheap new from dealer) into stock 2.4 block...(there are locally even, several big turbo 2.4 stratus block+crank, with SRT4 rods+pistons...running strong and high boost).

...add SRT4/PT-GT exhaust manifold + turbo...but dont hook up the coolant lines (just plug closed)...and drill+install an oil drain back through the pan, using 2 A/N fittings (back-to-back), and with braided line up to the turbo...a feed line can be done from front of block (sender) via braided line & A/N fittings easily as well.

Add in SRT4 fuel pump (walbro 160ish), run a return line (hint - use a second factory fuel hard line, with hi-press hoses clamped on each end) set-up...

...and use a Rising rate AFPR (Begi is good choice here)...with SRT4 Stage/04 injectors, which will plug into 2.4 rail, but just need spacers for height adjustment.

Run an EBC or MBC for the waste-gate...get a stock SRT4 unit, or find (better) a Stage 2 SRT4 WGA, which has an adjustable arm (and slightly stiffer spring rate)...

Its easy to have a muffler shop fab up the down-pipe...purchase a vendors 2.5" or 3" O2 housing to make it easier.

The stock SRT4 intercooler works well, and fits into several packages, as it's widened for around the radiator...or use another style intercooler to best fitment.

Have the muffler shop also fab up a turbo-to-intercooler pipe...or purchase 'used' the SRT4 turbo-to-intercooler pipe, which runs behind & under the engine/trans.

Stock 2.4 intake works fine still...or even a 2.0 with shorter runners, and larger 52-55mm TB.

The stock NA 2.4 cams work pretty well here...but adjustable cam gears will allow for some further fine tuning on dyno (but are not required items).

Tune with a wide-band, or better is on dyno..tune to good A/F settings.

Good luck!


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