Lots of valve train noise after tons of work!

[navyboy65]

Ok after a long time in the making I got the car back togeather today after having this work done to the head:
New Seals
New head plugs
Oil plug welded
Cometic Head Gasket
Head Studs
Head ported, valve job, cleaned, resurfaced and checked.
Performance regrind cams(from Delta Cams).
+ A few years back in 05 I installed the new lifters.


Here's what happened when I got running. Pretty much fired right up! BUt I noticed lots of noise comming from the valve train.Last Time I had it running before all this work was about 3 months ago and I don't remember it making that much noise. If anything I think the injectors back them made more noise!!!! Anyways I stopped it and took off the in take valve cover. Every thing looked ok(I did properly torque doen the rocker shaft bolts), I wiggled the rockers and most seemed loose. I could get them to move about a 1/4" or so off the tip of the valve. This would seem to me what would be making the noise, but how??? Is it the cams I'm using??? Any thoughts??? Help??? Advice????? Fixes??????


Car is a 92 Spirit R/T with 86K miles or so(don't exactly remember off the top of my head)

[4Daytonas]

Regrind cams take material off the base circle to gain lift and different profile.I don't know much about T3s but I suspect you will have to somehow shim the lash adjusters(lifters) higher in the bores to compensate for the amount taken off the base circle.In pushrod engines we had to get longer pushrods.

[navyboy65]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4Daytonas Regrind cams take material off the base circle to gain lift and different profile.I don't know much about T3s but I suspect you will have to somehow shim the lash adjusters(lifters) higher in the bores to compensate for the amount taken off the base circle.In pushrod engines we had to get longer pushrods.

That was my thinkin that te cams were the culprit. But how do I shim them up???? I'm not sure??? Thanks for the insite and help!

[Screamin4banger]

Find the sheet that cam with your cams or call Delta to find out what base circle you are dealing with. subtract that from the factory base circle and then divide by 2 to get the difference in radius. Multiply that number by the rocker ratio to get an idea of the thickness of shim you're looking for.

[lotashelbys]

There is no good way to shim them up. If you were to put a shim in between the rocker bore and the lifter it would not oil properly. The only way to do it is to either cut the valve seat deeper or get some lash-caps for the end of the valves. The re-ground cams I have sitting here(Delta I think)were only missing 010 on the base and the hydraulic lash adjuster cam make up for that.

Frist thing is to see if you got the rocker shafts in upside-down and then to see if they are on the correct side. If that is ok then the only other thing that I can think of is if the oil hole on the deck side was welded too deep and is blocking the oil galley to the exhaust rocker shaft. If all this looks good it must be the cams. Can you measure the base circle and the lobe with a caliper by chance? I can measure a known stock cam to see what the difference is.....

[mopar2ya]

I dont know how much Deltas grinds off but thats one place to look. Also, depending on the how the valve job was done can effect geometry.. Also is every thing oiling out the rockers? Are the rocker shafts on correctly?

[Will Martin]

How's your oil pressure? Sounds like your top end isn't getting proper oiling.

[4sfed4]

Quote:

Originally Posted by navyboy65 BUt I noticed lots of noise comming from the valve train.Last Time I had it running before all this work was about 3 months ago and I don't remember it making that much noise. If anything I think the injectors back them made more noise!!!! Anyways I stopped it and took off the in take valve cover.

How long did you let it run? Many times I noted that, when TIII engines sat awhile without being run, the valvetrain was noisy (when it wasnt previously). But, once the engine ran awhile (maybe 5-10 minutes) it was fine.

[4Daytonas]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lotashelbys There is no good way to shim them up. If you were to put a shim in between the rocker bore and the lifter it would not oil properly. The only way to do it is to either cut the valve seat deeper or get some lash-caps for the end of the valves. The re-ground cams I have sitting here(Delta I think)were only missing 010 on the base and the hydraulic lash adjuster cam make up for that. Frist thing is to see if you got the rocker shafts in upside-down and then to see if they are on the correct side. If that is ok then the only other thing that I can think of is if the oil hole on the deck side was welded too deep and is blocking the oil galley to the exhaust rocker shaft. If all this looks good it must be the cams. Can you measure the base circle and the lobe with a caliper by chance? I can measure a known stock cam to see what the difference is.....

Lash caps ok if you can get them thick enough---DO NOT SINK THE VALVES!

[navyboy65]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Screamin4banger Find the sheet that cam with your cams or call Delta to find out what base circle you are dealing with. subtract that from the factory base circle and then divide by 2 to get the difference in radius. Multiply that number by the rocker ratio to get an idea of the thickness of shim you're looking for.

I don't remember getting any specs from them so I just e-mailed them to hopefully get it!

[navyboy65]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lotashelbys There is no good way to shim them up. If you were to put a shim in between the rocker bore and the lifter it would not oil properly. The only way to do it is to either cut the valve seat deeper or get some lash-caps for the end of the valves. The re-ground cams I have sitting here(Delta I think)were only missing 010 on the base and the hydraulic lash adjuster cam make up for that. Frist thing is to see if you got the rocker shafts in upside-down and then to see if they are on the correct side. If that is ok then the only other thing that I can think of is if the oil hole on the deck side was welded too deep and is blocking the oil galley to the exhaust rocker shaft. If all this looks good it must be the cams. Can you measure the base circle and the lobe with a caliper by chance? I can measure a known stock cam to see what the difference is.....

Yeah I was thinking how I could shim it if needed and can't really think of any, but thanks for the lash-cap idea!
I'm away with work already but when I get back home I plan to re check to make sure I installed everything right!!!! I do know that both intake and ex. are noisy. If I can measure them I will.
Thanks for the help!!!

[navyboy65]

Quote:

Originally Posted by mopar2ya I dont know how much Deltas grinds off but thats one place to look. Also, depending on the how the valve job was done can effect geometry.. Also is every thing oiling out the rockers? Are the rocker shafts on correctly?

I wouldn't think the ground too much off. For the valve job, is there something I could do to fix it or is that something that just needs some more break in time??? I am pretty sure I put it all togeather right, as for oiling, when I puller the intake cover it all looked like it was gettin oiled.

[navyboy65]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Will Martin How's your oil pressure? Sounds like your top end isn't getting proper oiling.

I did some pre-cranking to strat getting the oil to flow. But It did run for 2-5 seconds with no psi reading and slightly more noise than when the psi kicked in. But according to my mechanical oil psi gauge I'm getting 50-60psi.

[navyboy65]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 4sfed4 How long did you let it run? Many times I noted that, when TIII engines sat awhile without being run, the valvetrain was noisy (when it wasnt previously). But, once the engine ran awhile (maybe 5-10 minutes) it was fine.

Oh I think total run time so far is less than 5min. Providing I do have everything installed correctly, I have proper oil flow, and it's possibly that I need to shim it up. Would I break or damage anything by running it for 5-10 mins to test if thats my prob? + It would break in time on the cams!

[rx2mazda]

Take off the VC's and start her up, make sure you are getting proper oiling everywhere. If not, shut it off after 10 seconds. Who welded the head?