Is the 16v conversion worth the work/cost

[QKsilverF1]

for safety id go ahead and add 20-30% of what you calculate its going to cost honestly

[90Shadow]

Yes, an overhead is always a good idea.

[ozspeed]

The conversion is not worth it IMAO. Been there, done that.

Buy a 2.4L with a tranny, put in the 2.5L pistons and T2 rods. All you need is to fab three motor mounts and you end up with 1) stronger short block, 2) stronger 5 speed/same automatic, 3) a lot less to fool with than a hybrid conversion 4) a lot lower cost to run the same hp

Kev

[sillywabbit]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ozspeed The conversion is not worth it IMAO. Been there, done that. Buy a 2.4L with a tranny, put in the 2.5L pistons and T2 rods. All you need is to fab three motor mounts and you end up with 1) stronger short block, 2) stronger 5 speed/same automatic, 3) a lot less to fool with than a hybrid conversion 4) a lot lower cost to run the same hp Kev

A few corrections here. First of all, the SRT4 rods/pistons are a much better choice for this application. The 5 speed tranny with any standard (non srt4) car is not stronger, in fact its weaker. You only need to fabricate 1 motor mount, not 3.

[kedavis]

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmniGTI A few corrections here. First of all, the SRT4 rods/pistons are a much better choice for this application. The 5 speed tranny with any standard (non srt4) car is not stronger, in fact its weaker. You only need to fabricate 1 motor mount, not 3.

Well the rod thing is all about opinion I believe the rod bolt choice might be more important then the rod itself there both strong rods.The srt-4 pistons are hyperutectic so high boost apps.with a big turbo and slight detonation and you will break them.If you can afford it use forged they will save you if you make a slight mistake while tuning.I know I had to fab 3 mounts that includes the custom bobble,the only drop in mount is the trans mount(in the auto)not sure about the stick I know 568 has been used.

[ozspeed]

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmniGTI A few corrections here. First of all, the SRT4 rods/pistons are a much better choice for this application. The 5 speed tranny with any standard (non srt4) car is not stronger, in fact its weaker. You only need to fabricate 1 motor mount, not 3.

????

This goes against some pretty well documented fast cars. Maybe you have a different source that states opposite?

True, the SRT pistons are a good choice, however the rods are same if not weaker than the T2 rods.

The stock 350 tranny in a neon has proven to be a strong choice, and needs work on the diff (typical TD stuff).

My opinion is just that, my opinion. I have done the hybrid thing (I think I had the first website for it), have done the 2.4 thing, and have done the SRT4 thing. This doesnt mean I am an expert, just some guy who has tried stuff.

[sillywabbit]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ozspeed ???? This goes against some pretty well documented fast cars. Maybe you have a different source that states opposite? True, the SRT pistons are a good choice, however the rods are same if not weaker than the T2 rods. The stock 350 tranny in a neon has proven to be a strong choice, and needs work on the diff (typical TD stuff). My opinion is just that, my opinion. I have done the hybrid thing (I think I had the first website for it), have done the 2.4 thing, and have done the SRT4 thing. This doesnt mean I am an expert, just some guy who has tried stuff.

I said use the SRT4 rods/pistons because the SRT4 pistons were made for a 16V, are stronger than 2.5 pistons, and yield better compression. As for the rods, I stated that because they come as a combo from the dealer with the pistons, are just as strong as t2 (not stronger or weaker per say but the t2 needs good arp bolts to stay together as well) and are really cheap. 52$ for each rod/piston. It just doesnt make good sense to use a 2.5 piston and t2 rods on a 2.4 swap.

The stock neon's tranny internals are not as strong as say, a 568, but its certainly upgradeable.

As for who you are, I am aware. In fact I bought your hybrid top end from the Shadow at one point.

[contraption22]

The SRT pistons are cheap, but less than ideal. We are using them in my brother's Neon, and if he hadn't gotten a little too greedy with the boost without any ignition retard, they probably would have survived.
The crown design is nice for for idle quality and part throttle drivability, but is a tradoff in power output. A conventional dished piston, (or ideally a piston with a crown made to take more advantage of combustion chamber quench) would be much better.

[sillywabbit]

Quote:

Originally Posted by contraption22 The SRT pistons are cheap, but less than ideal. We are using them in my brother's Neon, and if he hadn't gotten a little too greedy with the boost without any ignition retard, they probably would have survived. The crown design is nice for for idle quality and part throttle drivability, but is a tradoff in power output. A conventional dished piston, (or ideally a piston with a crown made to take more advantage of combustion chamber quench) would be much better.

I agree with this completely. Obviously an aftermarket forged piston with a dish that actually reaches the top of the deck would be better. The SRT$ design is a bit odd. However, I was just comparing "cheap vs cheap" in which case SRT Rod/Piston is the way to go.

[ozspeed]

Quote:

Originally Posted by OmniGTI I said use the SRT4 rods/pistons because the SRT4 pistons were made for a 16V, are stronger than 2.5 pistons, and yield better compression. As for the rods, I stated that because they come as a combo from the dealer with the pistons, are just as strong as t2 (not stronger or weaker per say but the t2 needs good arp bolts to stay together as well) and are really cheap. 52$ for each rod/piston. It just doesnt make good sense to use a 2.5 piston and t2 rods on a 2.4 swap. The stock neon's tranny internals are not as strong as say, a 568, but its certainly upgradeable. As for who you are, I am aware. In fact I bought your hybrid top end from the Shadow at one point.

Its all cool ....... just different opinions on getting to the same place.

[russ jerome]

This thread is about cost's of Hybrid and viable other swap's like the
2.4/2.0 family. Being a sticky all other posts will be deleted.

[89Waredaytona]

in terms of the money thing, would it be cheaper to bend your own steel lines for the oil feed and return? is something like that even possible? i understand that braided steel line is flexible and strong, but would hard steel line work as well?

Scott

[Garret]

Couldn't see why it wouldn't work. I just use steel braided hydralic hose, costs like 59 cents a foot and is readily availible

[dalek]

Only problem I have with hard turbo oil lines is that it can be a pain when you have to take the turbo off. In my Mercedes tubodiesel, I ended up snapping the oil feed hardline due to have to bend it to take turbo out. So, I ended making something using hydraulic hose and and fittings. It sure made life much easier. In my turbo Volvo I am having the very same issue, so I am getting parts to replace the lines.

[abiba_69]

In a 2.5L 5 speed TI application, i would be looking to do the whole 16V conversion due to me having to take the head off cause of broken exhaust bolts. Is there a 16V head i could just kinda toss on with very little or even better, NO mods??

Chris