91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing - Turbo Dodge Forums : Turbo Dodge Forum for Turbo Mopars, Shelbys, Dodge Daytona, Dodge SRT-4, Chrysler PT Cruiser, Omni and more!
TurboDodge.com MarketPlace Shelby Registry Contact Us

Advertisement - Remove these ads today by clicking here.
Go Back   Turbo Dodge Forums : Turbo Dodge Forum for Turbo Mopars, Shelbys, Dodge Daytona, Dodge SRT-4, Chrysler PT Cruiser, Omni and more! > Turbo specific > Carburetted and TBI Injected


Carburetted and TBI Injected Feel free to discuss any subject that is specific to these cars, including but not limited to: modification, tuning, repair, parts replacement, identification and restoration. This is the place to talk about ALL-MOTOR performance and MPI conversions.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
Old 08-15-2010, 06:12 PM   #1
Unhappy 91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing  
TD New Guy
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: SE CT

My Ride: 91 Shadow Convt
1/4: 0.000

Posts: 15
Feedback: (0)
4pt9fiero is keeping the peace
I have a 91 Dodge Shadow vert that I picked-up for $100 bucks that had a blown headgasket. When I brought it home I was able to drive it into the driveway and get it where I needed to do the gasket job.

No sooner than I got it back together and was attempting to start it the fuel pump took a crap. Replaced it and was able to get the engine to fire, but it doesn't seem right.

I understand that when you line up all the static timing marks, i.e. cam gear, intermediate shaft gear and crank, that the distributor drive is parallel to the block/crank.

When I initially put the head back on and lined up the marks the only way I could get the thing to start was to turn the distributor as far counter-clockwise as I could get it, but it would not rev beyond 2000 rpm.

When I do get it to run it runs ok, but when it warms up I am unable to restart.

I pulled the timing belt cover off and double checked everything and found that I was one tooth off on the cam gear and one off on the I-shaft. Reset everything and the same again, the rotor points directly to the front of the engine parallel with the crank. I was again able to fire it up but only if the distributor was adjusted as far counterclockwise as I could get it - basically getting the rotor to point directly at the number 1 post on the distributor.

My understanding is that it should run if all the marks are set appropriately and the flat side of the distributor is adjusted such that it is parallel with the crank - if I do that there is about a 40 degree difference between the rotor at tdc and the cap if it is parallel. Again I am only able to get it to run if I have the rotor pointing directly at the #1 on the distributor. This causes me not to be able to adjust the distributor to set the timing at 12 BTDC - I can't get the timing mark to appear in the window, and like I said above, and it won't start after it warms up.

This is the third dodge 2.5 I have worked on (i.e., head replacement, timing belt, head gasket) and it is the first one I have had any trouble with.

Can anyone provide any information on how to correct this?

I am tempted to readjust the I-shaft so that when the crank and cam are at TDC the rotor points #1 when the flat side of the distributor is parallel to the crank so that I have some adjustment.
4pt9fiero is offline  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message Share on facebook
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 08-15-2010, 06:17 PM   #2
Re: 91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing  
TD New Guy
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Scottsbluff, NE

My Ride: 89 shelby daytona
Engine: 2.2 TII
Induct: Turbo
1/4: 0.000

Posts: 76
Feedback: (0)
Moparfury123 is keeping the peace
maby some one took out the distributer to try and fix it at one time have you tried taking it out and rotating it 180 i did that with one i got some one had messed with

the guy could not get it to run the belt had jumped so i timed it and it would not run spun around the roter and fired up
Moparfury123 is offline  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-15-2010, 07:10 PM   #3
Re: 91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing  
NAJ
Just A Guy


 
NAJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: New Jersey

My Ride: 1990 Daytona Shelby
Engine: 2.2 L VNT
Induct: Turbo
1/4: 15.570

Posts: 19,499
Feedback: (24)
NAJ is keeping our cars runningNAJ is keeping our cars running
Welcome to TD!!!
Removing all spark plugs makes this procedure much easier.
Verify you are at true TDC on #1 cylinder by being sure the timing mark on the flywheel aligned with 0 on the bellhousing.
Align the mark on the intermidiate shaft with the mark on the crankshaft.
Align the slot in the cam with 12 o'clock centerline of the cylinder head.
The head is on an angle so it will not be straight up and down.
Install the belt and tension(on the front side).
Rotate the crankshaft 2 revolutions clockwise by hand then bring #1 to TDC and recheck mark alignment and tension.
With all of the marks aligned and the distributor removed the slot should be parallel to the block.
With the distributor in place the rotor should be pointing towards #1 cylinder on the distributor cap.
If all lines up properly having the distributor housing parallel to the block should have ignition timing close enough to start the vehicle.





__________________
Jan
1990 Daytona Shelby VNT

35 Years ASE Certified
NAJ is offline  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-15-2010, 07:44 PM   #4
Re: 91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing  
TD New Guy
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: SE CT

My Ride: 91 Shadow Convt
1/4: 0.000

Posts: 15
Feedback: (0)
4pt9fiero is keeping the peace
NAJ,

I verified this today, I was one tooth off on the cam and the I-Shaft. I did exactly as you write to set the timing properly, but it will not start unless I rotate the distributor CCW as far as it will go to get the rotor to point as close as possible to #1. On your yellow drawing my rotor is dead center between #1 and #2.

If I try to start it without rotating the distributor to the stop it will not start. Is there anything else I should look at?

Like I said in my first post, I am tempted to take the belt off and set the I-Shaft so that the distributor is pointed to #1 when the flat side of the distributor is parallel with the crank. I understand that the marks will not line up but it would provide additional adjustment.
4pt9fiero is offline  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-15-2010, 07:57 PM   #5
Re: 91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing  
Garrett Booster
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: greensboro, nc

My Ride: daytona
Engine: 2.2L turbo
Induct: Turbo
1/4: 0.000

Posts: 169
Feedback: (1)
speedy is keeping the peace
maybe you have a bad dist.....take the cap off and look at where the rotor points when the oil pump pins are paralell..the pins may be off or the spring pin has broken causing the rotor to be misallinged
speedy is offline  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-15-2010, 07:58 PM   #6
Re: 91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing  
NAJ
Just A Guy


 
NAJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: New Jersey

My Ride: 1990 Daytona Shelby
Engine: 2.2 L VNT
Induct: Turbo
1/4: 15.570

Posts: 19,499
Feedback: (24)
NAJ is keeping our cars runningNAJ is keeping our cars running
With the marks aligned and the distributor out is the slot on the oil pump parallel to the block.
If the intermidiate shaft or oil pump was out at one time and not aligned properly that would be your issue.
If that is the case as far as I know it will not harm anything other than the distributor being off.
Your options would be to remove the pump and realign the shaft/pump or move the intermiate shaft so #1 is pointing to the right position on the cap and mark the intermidiate shaft for future reference.
NAJ is offline  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-15-2010, 09:24 PM   #7
Re: 91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing  
TD New Guy
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: SE CT

My Ride: 91 Shadow Convt
1/4: 0.000

Posts: 15
Feedback: (0)
4pt9fiero is keeping the peace
The slot on the oil pump is parallel to the block which puts the rotor in between #1 and #2 (pointing to the front of the motor) - to far before #1 to be able to fire. As I said above I have to have the dist rotated as far CCW as possible to get it to start. (If you were to take the yellow picture above you would have to make #3 be at the top, making #1 at the 9 o'clock position of the drawing to get it to run.) Then if it starts there is no room to make any more adjustments to the timing.

It will start like this when cold, but after I get it warmed up it will not restart.
4pt9fiero is offline  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-16-2010, 08:20 AM   #8
Re: 91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing  
NAJ
Just A Guy


 
NAJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: New Jersey

My Ride: 1990 Daytona Shelby
Engine: 2.2 L VNT
Induct: Turbo
1/4: 15.570

Posts: 19,499
Feedback: (24)
NAJ is keeping our cars runningNAJ is keeping our cars running
If all the marks are aligned and the oil pump slot is parallel to the block everything in the engine is correct.
That only leaves the distributor as the problem.
With the distributor out of the car if you position the rotor to face #1 cylinder on the cap is the shaft parallel to the distributor housing?
Check with one from your local parts house or JY and see if it sits in the same position.
Also...Is this a 2.5L TBI or turbo?
NAJ is offline  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-16-2010, 10:16 AM   #9
Re: 91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing  
TD New Guy
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: SE CT

My Ride: 91 Shadow Convt
1/4: 0.000

Posts: 15
Feedback: (0)
4pt9fiero is keeping the peace
I will take post some pics this evening when I get home so everyone can see what I is happening.

It is a TBI unit.
4pt9fiero is offline  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-16-2010, 03:59 PM   #10
Red face Re: 91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing  
TD New Guy
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: SE CT

My Ride: 91 Shadow Convt
1/4: 0.000

Posts: 15
Feedback: (0)
4pt9fiero is keeping the peace
Thank you all - I found my problem. When I was taking pictures to post so that you all could verify what was going on, look what I found. These pictures were taken with the engine at TDC. Someone obviously pulled the oil pump at some time and did not index it properly when they put it back in. Sorry for jumping the gun earlier - I could have sworn that I pulled the dist when I had it at TDC and the slot was parallel to the block.[IMG][/IMG]
I know that the proper fix is to pull the pan and reindex the pump, but I will be reindexing the intermediate shaft and paint on new marks.

I'll let you all know how I make out when I get it done.
4pt9fiero is offline  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-16-2010, 04:07 PM   #11
Re: 91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing  
TryHard Status


 
turismolover22's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Indiana

My Ride: 1986 Daytona Turbo Z
Engine: 2.2 TII
Induct: Turbo
1/4: 0.000

Posts: 9,839
Feedback: (11)
turismolover22 is keeping our cars running
Well we are glad you got it figured out, Hope it works out for you.....means one more happy TD'er on the road
turismolover22 is offline  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-17-2010, 05:29 AM   #12
Re: 91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing  
NAJ
Just A Guy


 
NAJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: New Jersey

My Ride: 1990 Daytona Shelby
Engine: 2.2 L VNT
Induct: Turbo
1/4: 15.570

Posts: 19,499
Feedback: (24)
NAJ is keeping our cars runningNAJ is keeping our cars running
We have all overlooked the obvious at one time or another.
Glad to hear the problem has been located.

To quote old proverbs...
"Sometimes you cannot see the forest for the tree's"
"The first time is an experiance, the second time is a mistake"
NAJ is offline  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-20-2010, 02:08 PM   #13
Re: 91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing  
TD New Guy
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: SE CT

My Ride: 91 Shadow Convt
1/4: 0.000

Posts: 15
Feedback: (0)
4pt9fiero is keeping the peace
I re-indexed the intermediate shaft and she fired right up. Took it for a short drive last night - it drives and stops! Now to fix the inop speedo and put on a new top and .... and .... and.....
4pt9fiero is offline  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Old 08-21-2010, 06:16 AM   #14
Re: 91 Dodge Shadow 2.5 Timing  
NAJ
Just A Guy


 
NAJ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: New Jersey

My Ride: 1990 Daytona Shelby
Engine: 2.2 L VNT
Induct: Turbo
1/4: 15.570

Posts: 19,499
Feedback: (24)
NAJ is keeping our cars runningNAJ is keeping our cars running
Glad to hear she is running.
NAJ is offline  
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Tags
ignition timing, n/a, timing, timing adjustment, timing belt

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Turbo Dodge Forums : Turbo Dodge Forum for Turbo Mopars, Shelbys, Dodge Daytona, Dodge SRT-4, Chrysler PT Cruiser, Omni and more! forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

Member names may only be composed of alpha-numeric characters. (A-Z and 0-9)

!!ATTENTION ADVERTISERS!! If you intend on advertising anything on this forum, whatsoever, you are required to first contact us here . Additionaly, we do NOT allow BUSINESS NAMES unless you are an Authorized Vendor. If you own a business, and want to do sales on this site via posting or private message, you will need to follow the rules. Shops, Stores, Distributors, Group Buys without being authorized will see your account terminated.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.3.2

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:01 PM.