Why not AWD

[5.8LImportEater]

Quote:

Originally Posted by TurboBuggy 3 of 4 tires are not driven off half of anything. The front axles spline into the differential's spider gears the same way that they do in FWD. The PTU input shaft splines into the differential housing so it is basically connected solid with the ring gear.

I am not disagreeing with you, as I have never seen one in person. What I am saying is that the input shaft on all the drawings of the PTU's show a solid input shaft. How does the PTU spline into the differential housing with a solid shaft yet the axle spline into the spider gear with a solid shaft? You can't put a solid THROUGH a solid. Now if the input of the PTU is hollow, and splines on the outside of the housing while the axle splines into the spider gears I can get what you say, but none of the diagrams I have seen or the pictures show a hollow input for the PTU.

Either way I am excited to see if we can adapt a Quaife LSD to the PTU so we can have real AWD for an evil little omni....
Chris.

[Reaper1]

The input shaft of the PTU is in fact hollow. The passenger's side axles slides through it to engage the spider gear splines and the PTU is driven directly off of the diff housing as described before...

[Reaper1]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dodgecaravan95 but can u get 500 hp but have the torq?

I don't want to hijack, but I DO want to say that I have more torque than I know what to do with out of my 2.2, and it's only really bolts ons!! How does 291ft-lb sound? I'll tell ya...frying tires!!!

[5.8LImportEater]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reaper1 The input shaft of the PTU is in fact hollow. The passenger's side axles slides through it to engage the spider gear splines and the PTU is driven directly off of the diff housing as described before...

Ok, this explains a lot, now the differential has Timken bearings on the outside edge setting the play and such, does the differential extend past where the bearing rides? basically what I am wondering is all the rearends I have built have the differential/shims/bearings, and the differential is flush with the bearing, there is nothing to spline into, unless the differential is different from the ones I have seen, and extends past it and has splines machined into it.

I also wonder if the problems is the metallurgy a problem with PTU's or is it a design flaw? Could cryogenics help keep these units together? I would love to have an AWD omni with 400+hp. Oh, and if the awd diff is different than a LSD, can a LSD be machined to accept the PTU.
Chris

[CWELLMAN1]

back to the original question it could work witha little bit of wild fabrication if you used a 4x4 front axle w/ independent suspention s10 type and awd rear end the axles swaped around at the u joint part if nessesary the only major prob is at the gear ratios of the axles but alot of modifing would go in to it . it makes sense to me and the drive shafts would suck to?

[Reaper1]

From what I understand the AWD diff uses a larger bearing than the standard diff on the passenger's side. The splines for the PTU shaft are internal splines on the ID of the bearing "snout"(for lack of a better term at the moment) and are probably done via EDM. This could be done to any diff as long as it has the meat on the "snout" to do so. You also need the matching bearing retainer cup, or machine out the stock one from the tranny to accept the larger outer bearing race.

As I saidm this information is based on what I've read from other's experiences. I've never held one in my hands, so if something needs to be edited, then somebody with more experience than I please do so!

[3.0V6T]

i was just about to post a topic about this...i seen a awd dodge minivan yesterday then i was thinking what about the dsms? the tsi gsx and rs all came awd. the wheelbase on a baron is 103.5 in and the base on dsms is 97.2 in. the second gen caravan se had a wheelbase of 112 in. so would you just have to modify the driveshift? im not sure of the track but i dont think it could be that off.

[Mac_17]

whats wrong with using the awd drive system from underneath an awd steatlh/3000gt or laser and just comizing where needed to have it fit

[3.0V6T]

those could be possible platforms too!

[kreel]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mac_17 whats wrong with using the awd drive system from underneath an awd steatlh/3000gt or laser and just comizing where needed to have it fit

You can bolt a 3L up to the 3S drivetrain, but the biggest problem is you have to do a 180* flip to make it work. Yes, it can fit...but you have to customize pretty much everything; mounts, wiring, rear-end, an endless amount of fabrication. It would be a cool project in the end, but tons of time and $$$.

[XIBIOUS]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Timmay2 Why not AWD ?

Well Im going to try and answer the question posed.

The driveshaft for a plymouth voyager awd is next to impossible to find NEW, and totally impossible to find rebuilt or parts to rebuild it.

Now the price is also a little discouraging, its over $800 US.

Good thing is that you dont need it to drive the vehicle and you get better gas milage without the driveshaft.

If anybody knows anything about this item please send me a line df_xibious@hotmail.com

I think the trans is from Toyota like the other minivans, it may be avail for a toyota vehicle somewhere.

[Reaper1]

Ummm, the tranny is 100% MOPAR. The design that was used by Toyota for the Celica AllTrac was "borrowed" from the Daytona+4 concept back in the early '80's.

The driveshaft can be built by any compitant dirveshaft shop. The only *real* issues are the rear diff and the PTU on the tranny, but both seem to be fairly stout based on research and photos by others.

The design was "carried" over in the the AWD Pacifica for a while, so parts availability for some of this stuff shouldn't be too horrible, not to mention AWD vans were produced well in to the 2000's.

Why AWD? Better launch capability, better road course manners, better autocross manners, and of course the "cool" factor.... So, again, why not AWD?

[AntscoLANCER87]

I remember reading about a Shelby prototype AWD Daytona back in '87 or '88 in one of the car mag's. Shelby had set it up for enhanced handling, not drag racing.
The AWD in the Caravan is based on Shelby's system. Back then 250 to 300 engine HP was top end stuff.

Anther AWD system that evolved around the same time and is still in use is the Mitsubishi for the Eclipse. That system might be more robust.

Antsco

[Ondonti]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AntscoLANCER87 I remember reading about a Shelby prototype AWD Daytona back in '87 or '88 in one of the car mag's. Shelby had set it up for enhanced handling, not drag racing. The AWD in the Caravan is based on Shelby's system. Back then 250 to 300 engine HP was top end stuff. Anther AWD system that evolved around the same time and is still in use is the Mitsubishi for the Eclipse. That system might be more robust. Antsco

Well, shelby didnt have a viscous coupler, so it was full time 4x4.

I dont know how you decided the purpose of the car though.


And the awd van stuff doesnt really look like shelby's unit. Shelby's looks a lot better :P

[AntscoLANCER87]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ondonti Well, shelby didnt have a viscous coupler, so it was full time 4x4. I dont know how you decided the purpose of the car though. And the awd van stuff doesnt really look like shelby's unit. Shelby's looks a lot better :P

Never looked under either vehical.

Seems that if shelby sent the reporter up on to the winding roads in the hills by the design shop and not to the drag strip in front of the factory, it follows that handling was the issue. But I could be wrong.