My RWD turbo "dodge" 1977 Toyota Celica Liftback GT 2.4L swap

[wicked93gs]

well, I decided to put this thread in the place best suited to it overall...the car is a 77 toyota celica liftback GT...picked it up non-running for a few hundred dollars and decided after much debate with myself about engine choices on a 2.4L of a sort





a few pictures of the car itself...heh, such a 69 mustang ripoff, but I'm not complaining since it weighs in stock at 2550 lbs




a few pictures of some minor rot I have to repair...not bad at all...its an Oregon car...also have some surface rust, etc, but a solid car overall



out with the old engine and tranny....the 20r isnt a bad engine...but its locked up and really doesnt have the potential of a more modern DOHC 16v engine


the block I will be using...pulled it from a 99 caravan for a cost of $65...of course it will be rebuilt with SRT parts before I am done...block looks to be in good shape


so I mocked the block up in the engine bay



this is the 420a eclipse head($35) with a DOHC neon manifold mocked up on it...topped by the caravan valve cover, this allows the exhaust to come out on the drivers side...like stock celica and also allows both the intake manifold and the future SRT turbofold to point forward


block and head mocked up in car...engine is still 3-4 inches too high and 1.5 inches too far forward...need to modify the oil pan and/or x-member, I'll decide which after I decided whether I really want to go through the headache of adding rack and pinion steering


note the 420 exhaust side water neck...comes out sideways...this just wont do...


not that you can see much with this cell phone picture...but I cut this waterneck off of the caravan manifold...it will likely need more modification before it works correctly, but it points forward...just like I wanted


speaking of the caravan intake manifold...here is the lower half mocked up...debating on a sheetmetal intake...either using this as a base...or using my stratus 2.4L as a base...I'm leaning toward the stratus...it has long runners(good in a turbo application) also considering using a Sebring composite plastic manifold...which also has long runners in addition to a central TB and being composite will also have lower IATs..again, good for turbo...decisions, decisions

thats it so far...but I am currently looking for a Liberty bellhousing if anyone has any leads in that area(so far my cheapest one I have found is $315...ridiculous cost for a bell) I will use the dakota option if I absolutely must, but the liberty bell is preferrable

[r2kool4u]

Wow this is awesome. Great idea and it looks like it is going to be a fun build.

[turbot11]

AWESOME! I like that body style and a 2.4 should be great motivation for it!

[92TurboTona]

i also love that 70's celica body style and good luck with the build as stated above that will be pretty flippin sweet when done, keep us posted on this build and make this your build thread

[wicked93gs]

Thanks guys, i have been considering a half dozen different tranny/bellhousing combos and cant seem to decide...a liberty/ma5 combo would be the first choice, but since i cant find a liberty bell at less than $350 its rather unworkable, besides lately i have started wanting a t5 for its .68 5th gear which will allow me 2300rpm 70mph cruise speed....which leaves me with a 88-92 dakota bell as a good option since its simple to adapt to the t5 except for the fact it really doesnt fit the 2.4 well, so that got me to thinking why not use the 2nd gen neon bell? True its short for a rwd bell and would need the diff cover cut off, but it has a lot of advantages to make it appealing. It can use stock neon clutch components except for the clutch disc and its hydraulic like the celica, the only real issue is input shaft length but thats easy too, take the t5 input shaft out and have a machine shop cut it down and throw it on the lathe, if the input shaft is the same length as a fwd application i wouldnt even need a pilot bearing...crazy idea? Or worth a shot? Neon trannies are a dime a dozen and due to the design of the bell finding the input shaft centerline is a piece of cake

[Turbomini]

hey if you want a 87-92 dakota 2.5 bell i have one you cover shipping lol

Sweet build! I look forward to watching this thread!

[wicked93gs]

Quote:

Originally Posted by turbomini hey if you want a 87-92 dakota 2.5 bell i have one you cover shipping lol

I guess that would depend on what you want for it...and what shipping would be to 37064...heh, Dakota bellhousings it seems I can find all over the place compared to the mythical liberty bell...I plan on collecting all the bells I can find and mocking up different combos before I decide on which I want

[CWELLMAN1]

that body + that power plant .that sould turn some heads when its done i'd love to see the 1/4 mile time!

[wicked93gs]

well, assuming decent traction...I would guess mid-low 12s at 275HP...although most srts making that are making 350ft/lbs of torque..so maybe even high 11s? the car weighs 2550lbs stock...the engine/tranny swap by itself loses 100lbs...the stock safety bumpers are being replaced by "JDM"(god, I hate that phrase) style fiberglass bumpers and will lose another 100lbs...those safety bumpers are heavy! and I am hoping to be able to strip off 100lbs elsewhere..too bad no one offers a fiberglass hood(that hood weighs more than the one for my 66 mustang) anyway, I am hoping for a final weight of 2250 without driver...which is a 8:1 power to weight ratio...slightly better than a caddilac cts-v...which runs a 11.9 1/4 stock....but I'm sure they get better traction than I will...my biggest issue will be fitting a decent size tire on the car...especially since I wont run drag radials...probably better to keep it in the 12s anyway, that way I wont have to put a roll cage in...but all that is just talking out my a$$ anyway, I would be happy with a high 13 sec time in all honesty...I used to be a lot more about all out power than I am these days...now I like building for balance, a fun street car is more appealing than an ill tempered track monster, this time the drivetrain will be the cheap part(the suspension stuff can all be upgraded as time permits though)

[Turbomini]

i mean you cover shipping its yours lol i have 3 of the bells i dont need another thing sitting around haha i have a shift fork but i dont have the hydrolic setup. lol.

[wicked93gs]

sure, that works for me...give me your zip so I can calculate shipping...also the size of the box you can fit it in...I would think something like 18x18x12 would work..but who knows what you have available?

News today for the project...not much, but some interesting info...went to the junkyard today looking for either one of the dakota bellhousings...no luck today, they were all V6s, except for one v8...didnt even know they had a v8 option except for the shelby dakota...anyway, after failing that I went looking at all the 2.4Ls...searching for a Composite plastic sebring valve cover and possibly composite manifold...no luck there either...but I did find a neon manual transmission so I thought I would measure the depth real of the bellhousing real quick to see if my crazy FWD bell idea has any potential....the depth is somewhere between 5 3/8" and 5 1/2" hard to get exactly with it still attached to the engine...anyway, after wandering the Ford section hoping for a T5...failure there too, but someone did pull a T5 from a v6 mustang and kindly left the bell laying there...so I was able to grab a measurement off that as well...7.5" exactly...so 2 inches difference...2 inches may seem like a lot, but here is where the beauty of the T5 comes into play...the v6 bell(and input shaft) is 3/4" longer than the earlier 5.0 bell...the early 5.0L input shaft is 7.18 long(total length)...however, the GM T5 input shaft is 6.5"....so using a GM input shaft would make it a total of 1.43" shorter which leaves just .57" difference that would need to made up with an adapter plate...allowing a T5 to bolt up to a modified(diff cover cut off) FWD neon bell simply by drilling 4 holes and using a 5/8" spacer plate(which would be needed anyway to house the front bearing retainer) So in short, the crazy idea is quite possible and almost simple to do while allowing me to retain the use of stock neon clutch components and starter(too bad this will place the starter directly under the turbofold...but that can be worked around) anyway, like I said, this is speculation...I will decide which bell to use once I have a few different choices and the T5 of course to work with

[Turbomini]

lol i can make a box thats no issue. and i'll message you my zip but i can get a mesurment off the dak bell and a t5 input i have both on hand. my brother has a t5 he is rebuilding and i have the bell. so no issue.

[wicked93gs]

the t5 input length would be nice...but I need to know which T5 as well...since there are about 50 different versions...can you post a pic of the back(tranny side) of the bell along with those measurements? Also when you measure the t5 input its important you measure from the front of the tranny...the bell must be removed and you cant measure off of the front bearing retainer....for instance, I know a 94-up mustang bell is 7.5" deep...meaning that the input shaft on that particular t5 is 7.87" long...meaning a little more than 1/4" of the input shaft extends past the bell...though I would assume thats how much rides on the pilot bearing it could be more since the pilot bearing may extend somewhat from the crankshaft on a 5.0 or 3.8....I know on my 4.6L Cobra engine the crank extends 1/4" or so past the block/tranny mating surface....what I would really appreciate even more than input shaft length is the start and stopping measurements of the clutch splines on that input shaft...which will allow me to know how much I can shorten the thing and still have full clutch engagement/disengagement

[Turbomini]

the trans is from a 5.0 mudstain lol but i'll get it tonight along with dakota bell depth