450cc Injectors -- What size RRFPR

[gorf1000]

In my 1994 Ply. Duster I'm looking to use 450cc injectors with my 16g turbo setup. I just picked up a Walbro 255 lb/h fuel pump now I just need to figure out my FMU. I don't want to go the route of a S-AFC since I'm trying to do this on a married/home-owner/single-income budget (meaning credit till I sell my current Intrepid), so I wanted to use a rising rate FPR.

I have a fuel rail with 450cc injectors already installed and ready to go I just need to figure out what ratio FMU to get, and I have no idea how to do that. Any suggestions would be immensly appreciated.... I'm so close to turning over that engine I can almost hear it.

[mwinkle353]

Those are going to be hell to try to get the motor to idle. I honestly don't think you'll be able to get the pressure down far enough for them to be effective. I hope you prove me wrong.

That is, unless you are ever going to be installing a stand-alone ecu.

But I don't recommend any of the single rate of gain regulators. Those will cause a slight state of lean at the lower boost levels. I would recommend an adjustable one. Like the BEGi units that are adjustable on rate of gain, and onset pressure.

[m90daytona]

you could cut off the stock fpr, tap it out to a #6npt fitting, and use an sfmu from vortech that will adjust both base and rising rate. you will have to get a few discs and see which one works best. i would try a 4:1, 5:1, or 6:1 to start.

btw...those injectors are WAY to big for your setup. those are 42lb injectors which would be good for 400-500hp. you need some 28lb injectors which at 80psi of fuel (5:1 disc at 10psi boost) would be good to 325 crank hp.

[Ntrain2k]

Those are also low imp. injectors if they came off of a DSM application.

Just an FYI....

[gorf1000]

Does anyone know what the stock injectors in the 3.0 are?
I saw in another post (heyyy 3.0 turbo set up) that you could use 24lb injectors with an 8:1 FMU. I got this kit from a forum member that installed this in his Acclaim, he was using a S-AFC.

[Ondonti]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gorf1000 Does anyone know what the stock injectors in the 3.0 are? I saw in another post (heyyy 3.0 turbo set up) that you could use 24lb injectors with an 8:1 FMU. I got this kit from a forum member that installed this in his Acclaim, he was using a S-AFC.

I dont believe that car ever ran with boost correctly.......

[gorf1000]

I don't know if it really did, and the injectors as I'm seeing may have been part of the reason why, I'm really new to turbo projects so I'm trying to learn as much as I can about how to select your injectors, fuel pressure, boost level, etc....

[mwinkle353]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gorf1000 Does anyone know what the stock injectors in the 3.0 are? I saw in another post (heyyy 3.0 turbo set up) that you could use 24lb injectors with an 8:1 FMU. I got this kit from a forum member that installed this in his Acclaim, he was using a S-AFC.

24# injectors will be ok, if you're only planning on running 5 psi of boost. After that, you'll lean out really quick. You may be able to get about 280hp out of those. But that's pushing it to the limits. It seems to me that the almost perfect match would be 30-33 pounders. You can run low base fuel pressure, and still be fairly economical during cruise and low load driving. And if you ramp up the pressures to 90 psi of fuel, they can flow as much as 45#'s.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ondonti I dont believe that car ever ran with boost correctly.......

I seem to remember that he spun a bearing on his setup. He stated that it ran fine @ 9 psi of boost. But, everything that I know of the PCM's programming and the way MAP signals effect fuel and ignition timing, it would probably be not be a very good setup. Most likely, too much advanced in the boost conditions, and not enough advance in the cruise/low load conditions.

[m90daytona]

in theory you could use 24lb injectors at 100psi (6:1 disc at 10psi boost) and get 310 crank hp. it all depends on what you want to do. the size of the disc in the fmu + base pressure is going to determine what fuel injectors to use *or* the fuel injectors + base pressure is going to decide what fmu disc to use. i would recommend 28lb-32lb injectors like i stated earlier. the car would idle great and it would give you room to work w/ if you ever want to increase boost.

here is a very helpful link for you http://www.rceng.com/technical.htm

[Ondonti]

the stock pump wont make 100psi. not to mention fuel flow isnt great there.



wink are you talking about turboacclaim kid who was overspinning his turbo with no IC piping installed?

[m90daytona]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gorf1000 In my 1994 Ply. Duster I'm looking to use 450cc injectors with my 16g turbo setup. I just picked up a Walbro 255 lb/h fuel pump now I just need to figure out my FMU. I don't want to go the route of a S-AFC since I'm trying to do this on a married/home-owner/single-income budget (meaning credit till I sell my current Intrepid), so I wanted to use a rising rate FPR. I have a fuel rail with 450cc injectors already installed and ready to go I just need to figure out what ratio FMU to get, and I have no idea how to do that. Any suggestions would be immensly appreciated.... I'm so close to turning over that engine I can almost hear it.

walbro 255lp/h is not the stock pump

[gorf1000]

My turbo kit came from Turbo 3.0 and it was intercooled.

Over on Allpar I got an answer saying that the stock FI are 48psi at the rail, from what I'm reading in this thread that seems way too high. I'm figuring though that the actual pressure is too low to simply add a FMU to the stock injectors?

Are these injectors (FWDPerformance 30# Injectors) basically what I'm looking for? Are there any suggestions of other locations I can look or is this a good price?

Sorry for badgering with questions, I'm just trying to learn from those who have been there before me.

[mwinkle353]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ondonti wink are you talking about turboacclaim kid who was overspinning his turbo with no IC piping installed?

No, it's a different one. I think the one you're referring to was running a 14B. Where the one I am talking about had a 16G on his setup. The one who decided to try his hand at a DOHC motor install, after he blew the SOHC motor.

[mwinkle353]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gorf1000 My turbo kit came from Turbo 3.0 and it was intercooled. Over on Allpar I got an answer saying that the stock FI are 48psi at the rail, from what I'm reading in this thread that seems way too high. I'm figuring though that the actual pressure is too low to simply add a FMU to the stock injectors? Are these injectors (FWDPerformance 30# Injectors) basically what I'm looking for? Are there any suggestions of other locations I can look or is this a good price? Sorry for badgering with questions, I'm just trying to learn from those who have been there before me.

What turbo came with that kit?


No, You do not want to use low Impedence injectors. Just get your hands on a a set of Ford 30# injectos (red tops). They are the correct impedence for our injector control circuits. I got mine from Ebay, many moons ago. And they seem to be working fine @ 28psi of pressure.

Stock injectors are 19#. If you are to install injectors more than 10% larger than stock, you need to lower your fuel pressure, or the motor will not run correctly. The pcm does not have enough "range" to compensate for the larger injectors, and you'll be rich all the time. That's why you need to lower your base fuel pressure when installing them.

[Harvii]

Stock injectors are 19#s at 48ish psi fuel pressure. I ran 33# injectors from a TurboII dodge and it was pig rich even when I was pushing 15psi of boost. At idle with my big injectors I was running around 18-20psi fuel rail pressure(pretty much the lowest I could possibly go) and it was still rich at idle.

This was all on a stock fuel pump. That 255 is gonna move even more fuel, thru the GIANORMOUS injectors you have.

Hope you've thought of upsizing the fuel return line. Thats the only way you're going to get low enough pressure to idle properly.

I've got low imped injectors/drivers so I was able to use the TD injectors.