Here's the info/specs, now advice?

[DustyR/T]

What do you think about the cam grinds judging by the crower card?
Anyone have factory cam specs I can compare to?

What's that on the bottom regarding the "Lobe Center 'Method of degreeing'"?

[Tim_K]

Are they making this grind available to anyone who wants it? What is the cost?

They say 0.050" tappet lift, but our tappets are on the valve end of the rocker arm. Should they be saying 0.050" lobe lift instead?

[DustyR/T]

does the grind look good?
If you like it, the job number is on the top and it only cost me 180 for both cams from crower.

I was looking for someone to put a lot of that information into laments terms

[charger R/T]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tim_K They say 0.050" tappet lift, but our tappets are on the valve end of the rocker arm. Should they be saying 0.050" lobe lift instead?

They actually say it twice in there and once each way.

Looks like it might be a nice set of cams. Should have a bit of a lope at idle. I would be interested in see the stock specs.
Tim

[Ondonti]

ahhh I hate cam numbers.
why the crap do they use negative numbers on the intake valve opening and exhaust valve closing. I guess its just that their card sucks and they just print numbers.

of course this card is 10x more helpful then mine lol. My cam guy wont give you that info.


One thing I dont understand about cams is how you can go from 182 adv duration to 264 adv duration and only gain .19" lift. I guess that means they removed a LOT of base circle diameter BUT they actually cut down the maximum lift on the lobe so that it will probably work on a stock head. (which is smart). I had thought about getting some cams for my spirit but I dont think the kind of cams I had made for my duster would work on a stock head.

[Tim_K]

What did Crower say about shimming the hydraulic lash adjusters to make up for the reduced base circle?

264 advertised duration with 205 @ 50 doesn't sound all that great to me, they're definitely not using a fast rate of lift lobe design. So it probably wasn't that hard to get it inside the stock lobe.

How much is the cam's base circle reduced when these cams are reground?

Ondonti - 0.019", not 0.19".

[DustyR/T]

Crower didn't say anything about shimming the lifters.

Yes they are lobey at idle-which is why I am probably running pig rich.

[moorepowercoati]

The cam is .369 at the valve assuming the actual ratio is 1.5, which in most cases is optimistic. 205 duration would be an RV grind in a 350 ci engine but in a 181 ci engine it will think it is a larger cam, With the 264 advertised duration, and 205 at .050, it should be a cam that is valvetrain friendly as it has a slower ramp up and sets the valves down easy on the seats. The 110 degree lobe separation is giving you a decent amount of overlap and could be working against your computer as most computer friendly cams are in the 112 to 114 degree centerline. The 106 degree installed is advancing the cam 4 degree's and probably is ground into the cam to start with. The reason for the minus specs is most likely due to the fact the card is preprinted and that 98% of the cams Crower grinds are larger and do not need them. Lift has little to do with duration, which is only a function of how fast the valves open and close. Unless you know when they begin and stop measuring lobe lift, you can not compare these numbers. Some makers start at .002 lift up to .020 lobe lift. That is why makers went to the .050 lift to measure duration. It looks to me like it should be a nice grind for a stick car, but I would like to see a 112 - 114 lc for an automatic. The 110 is fine, installed @ 106 for extra low end but I do not know how this slow of a computer works with the extra overlap, which reduces the vacuum signal. I am going to use Delta cams to grind me a set when I get my heads back from porting and know some flow #'s at various lift's. They will reweld and heat treat, so you do not have to mess with the reduced base circle. I would think with less than ..370 lift it should work well with stock heads, but I do not recall the max lift before the guides and seals . By rewelding I will be able to do away wil the different lsa's bewteen the front and rear cam. Delta has a website with prices of all sevrices, so look before asking me please! Has anyone tried offset Chevy bushings for degreeing your cam?

[Ondonti]

im still wondering how those cams Simon was selling would fit and not bottom out the valve retainers on the guide seals.

Ed should have better info then me on when valves bottom out since he is playing with this stuff all the time.

[DustyR/T]

"The 106 degree installed is advancing the cam 4 degree's and probably is ground into the cam to start with"

Thank you for all the information-very helpful.
Regarding this quote, are you saying I have to install them 4 degrees advanced?
It does confuse my vac signal because at idle it can't regulate the proper fuel and runs it rich.

Anyone have a stock comparison card or know of a website that does? Thanks.

[Ondonti]

i was getting 14.6 inches vacuum with my cam last time it was running. It was running rich but with the big injectors not quite tuned in right im not sure what to think. Maybe getting a good idle will be harder with cams and big injectors.

Do you have your bigger stuff installed yet or are you still lucky enough to have the stock injectors in.

[moorepowercoati]

What I mean is often times the cam is ground so that when you install it straight up with the gears, that instead of being at 110 it is already advanced at 106. Like I said I think it would be worth looking at the chevy offset bushings for adjusting centerline. Do not just assume that this is your only issue. If your coolant temp sensor is bad it may make your engine is cold all the time and it is just like the choke is on on a carbed vehicle. Have you tried bumping the timing more to raise cylinder pressure. The larger cams with more overlap cause the cylinder pressure to drop at lower speeds, but conversly let it breath better as the rpm's rise. It may be worth a call to Crower, tell them your grind # and ask them if the 4 degree's advance is built in or you need to advance the cams. The cams are not so big that you won't be able to make them work. The coolant temp sensor is cheap and I would try it first.

[DustyR/T]

I'm workin off the stock injectors still. Good point on the coolant sensor.
a.) I don't havea MIL on.
b.) It all seemed to be rich right after the head swap w/ the cams.
c.) Vac test held 20-22inches

any ideas?

[moorepowercoati]

20-22 does not sound that bad. Try the sensor. How does it run otherwise?

[DustyR/T]

runs good outside of idle.
It seemed more ballsey low end-mid range w/ the stock cams. Maybe it's just me. But top end picked up a little. I really do want to trace down the rich problem. Coolant sensors are cheap enough. I'll swap it and let ya know.