What is this?

[lookin]

Does anyone have any idea what this noise is?

It sounds like lash adjuster (lifter) clatter, but it is only noticeable between 2500-3000 rpm, and it is smooth and quiet when it starts.

Disconnecting spark plugs, one at a time, makes no difference in the sound at all, and so I doubt it is the bottom end.

The noise began immediately, when I changed oil, from Valvoline Syntech to Valvoline Maxlife synthetic. Two days later I had to drain it, slap on a new filter and refill, because the two day old oil was already filthy. Apparently Valvoline Maxlife really cleans like crazy.

Any advice would be appreciated.

[mopar3.0]

my engine did that too but it went away after a day at autox lol

[Avenger]

I'm taking bets on it still being the lifters ticking, just differently than you're used to. Perhaps the gunk in the lifter moved, allowing a bit less flow. Why it would be that RPM specific is a little odd though, usually they either tick or they don't.

[lookin]

OK. Thanks you guys. I was thinking the along the same lines.

It is a little bit of dislodged crud in a journal or galley, starving a lifter or two, and to clear it maybe I should run her hard instead of babying her.

The rpm specific part still throws me though, and that is why I asked about this here.

Thanks again.

[lookin]

This thread has gotten 69 views and only 2 people have replied.

Thanks a lot everybody.

[Ondonti]

If you still havent cleaned the lifters its all a guessing game.

[Tim_K]

Yeah, if the engine isn't machine shop freshly rebuilt clean, then you really don't know what's in there. Especially if someone else owned it before you.

I've been using Castrol GTX 10w-40 for years, and my engines have been clean inside even after 10's of thousands of miles.

But then again, I don't putt-putt around town like an old lady either, my engines get run pretty good.

[lookin]

What do you guys think of this?

I have been reading over at Allpar, that some people believe that Valvoline MAXLIFE is not good for 3.0s, because others have gotten the same results I have with it.

The stuff really does clean though, and apparently it dislodged deposits left over from whatever the dealer used for the 5/50 warranty period. Crappy filters too I bet. I bought it at 46K miles and switched to Mobil 1, but apparently Mobil 1 doesn't remove old dino deposits.

Tonight I am going to drain a quart and replace that with MMO, to remove the rest of the remaining dealer service period sludge, and hopefully that lash adjuster will pump up again when I change back to Valvoline Syntech on Friday.

What worries me is that it sounds like just 1 lash adjuster, in the back of course, but it only becomes noticeable between 2500-3000 rpm. It is still quiet at startup.

So is that still likely just a lash adjuster? Or does the onset at 2500 rpm indicate a bigger problem? Doesn't a wrist pin or rod bearing, produce a double clack sound, instead of a sharp tick like a noisy lifter?

[Tim_K]

The lifters are pretty easy to get at, even on the rear bank. After you take the airbox off, that is, but anyone here on a performance car site should NOT be using the stock 3.0 induction system anyhow!

When my 3.0 was all stock, it picked up 5-6 horsepower at the dragstrip just by pulling the airbox inlet hose off at the throttle body and making a run.

I never really believed all the BS about synthetic oils. Even if they do make the engine last longer, I doubt the extra cost is really worth it.

[lookin]

I have cowl inducted ram air. I have a reverse cowl scoop on the hood, that closes shaker style onto a sealed K&N Apollo, and that outside air goes directly to my 52 mm TB. It breathes no warm under hood air at all. All I can say, for sure without dyno testing it, is that it performs a whole lot better in hot weather than it used to.



I am thinking of switching to Valvoline Durablend 10w 30. Later I am going to AutoRX it, and then I know it will be totally clean inside.

If this plan fails I will put new lash adjusters in. Does anyone know if the generic HLAs are as good as the pricey Mitsu ones?

[Ondonti]

Cleaning them is very easy.

-Disconnect battery
-Pop off serpentine belt
-Pop the alternator off and place it up on the window wiper valley below the hood. Dont bother removing any of those wires.
-remove the rear valve cover
-loosen the 8 bolts holding down the rocker assembly.
-Pull up the rocker assembly till you can move the rockers enough to pull out the lifters (or turn the engine at the crankshaft to move the cam so the rocker arms are not being pushed on by a high lift spot of the cam)

-follow my cleaning instructions from that other thread

-Insert lifters again and..
-## put RTV under the edge of the rocker arm assembly (the 1/2" space where the metal clamps together next to the round seal) Probably dont need to replace those plug seals either but you can if you want to ##
-tighten down rocker assembly to about 15 ft/lb (or whatever the torque spec is)
-reinstall valve cover (i dont bother replacing the valve cover seals unless they are obviously bad. Most leaks are because the valve covers are too loose.)
-Reinstall alternator
-Reinstall serpentine belt.

[lookin]

This is our only vehicle right now though. If I take it apart, and screw something up (which is very possible), then we are stuck without a vehicle until I fix it. Trust me. I am so 'all thumbs' and inexperienced it may take me more than a weekend.

Since it happened immediately after an oil change, to stuff that loosened up a bunch of deposits, I think it is just a restricted journal starving a HLA, and so I will try a flush and refill first. Wouldn't a little marvel mystery oil clean the HLAs as it runs?

[lookin]

By the way thanks for the encouragement and the instructions Brent.

sigh

I'll may wind up doing it anyway, but I want to try the mmo and oil change first. If we had two rides I wouldn't hesitate.

Do those HLAs just pull out or what?

[Ondonti]

I messed up the instructions, forgot about the RTV. Added that step inbetween ## blah blah ##

I dont replace the plug seals (well i put new ones on my duster when i rebuilt the motor but I didnt bother on the 120k+ mile junkyark engine in my spirit).

The only seal you have to be careful about is the rear camshaft seal (the front one is inside the distributor housing). You have to make sure the rear camshaft seal is straight up and down so it will seal on both sides (it does the same thing as the plug seals but it has to have the camshaft go through it). Sometimes it gets bumped and will sort of tip over. That will mean it wont seal well against the camshaft OR the head/rocker assembly.

The HLA's just fall out of the rocker arm.

When you reinstall them, the oil hole side goes into the rocker arm because that is how oil gets into the lifter.

The only non intuitive part is the RTV trick to help things seal. I let a little bit ofextra rtv goop out so the weird little corner of your valve corner (where it wraps arond the camshaft/rocker assembly) seals nicely.

[Ondonti]

If you can do the serpentine belt then that is honestly the most annoying part of the project.

If you are just doing the rear lifters it should only take about 5 minutes to remove the lifters if you are using a speed wrench (I LOVE mine for this).

2 bolts on the alternator
2 bolts on the valve cover
8 bolts on the rocker arms and you dont remove those bolts. Then you just pull up on the rocker arms and catch the lifters. Be careful because they will fall out by themselves if you are not paying attention. Dont lose them

Cleaning will be the most pain in the butt issue.

My dusters lifters suck because I add shims/ washers to make up for my camshaft. To reinstall the lifters I have to remove the whole rocker assembly, and then install everything upside down (so i can align the washers) and then TAPE each lifter into place so they dont fall down and let the washer alignment get messed up.

You can just pop them back in without removing the assembly. It is a bit tricky trying to make sure they dont fall out after you put them back in. They want to fall out cause you have been pulling up on the rocker arm assembly and they have nothing pushing against them (the valve stems) to keep them from falling out.