P-body structural discussion

[Ondonti]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmitch damn and thats the "stronger" four door. lucky woman

The car looks damaged but it looks like the front corner of the car sideswiped a pole. The drivers side of the car isnt even damaged.

I would say the damage is more "looks" then reality. it ripped the front fender cover off and smashed the roofline a little.........

So not really a direct hit on the car. I dont think any car would look good after that kind of accident. Its possible a passenger would have survived with some head trauma (no airbag ) as the passenger compartment is pretty much intact. Just the corner of the cabin pushes in at the top.

[440trk]

Unibody cars (as mentioned) rely heavily on the rockers as part of the frame assembly. Anyone who has ever cut up any unibody car, can tell you, there is a LOT of strength in the rockers. That being said, it's pretty common to tie the frame rails together (as mentioned by Tim K) with box tube or pipe. That will add a significant amount of rigidity to any unibody, as well as help reduce body flex when cornering. (note: Autocross guys may want to check the rule to see if you can legally tie the frames for the class you are running). No real need to mess with the rockers, unless yours are heavily rusted.
Even a bolt in frame connector will stiffen the car up, and will help keep the floorboard from flexing in an impact. (providing it's installed properly.)

I'd have to look at my Daytona a bit closer...but I'm pretty sure making either a bolt in or weld in frame tie would be pretty simple. RWD Mopar drag racers and auto cross folks have been doing this for years. I'm guessing a quick search will turn up a couple of web pages showing a RWD frame tie install. Same basic proceedure for a FWD. I'll see if I can find any good links.

[440trk]

Here's one: Classic Barracuda Subframe Connector Installation - Mopar Muscle Magazine

Disregard the torque box install part...Torque Boxes only apply to RWD's... althougth the basic concept of them could possibly be transferred over to some suspension reinforcement on a FWD car, if needed.

[440trk]

Also, a properly designed frame connector, could also add additional support/rigidity to any roll cage. A little advanced planning could make a nice addition to the overall structure of ANY FWD car.

[Reaper1]

The problem is our front and rear subframes don't line up #1. #2 they are not at the same vertical level, the front subframe is significantly lower than the rear. Not only that, but there is no lateral connection between the rear subframe rails to connect to like shown on the Barracuda. I've been looking at this for YEARS. To tie the subfraims together under the car is not an easy task. It can be done as I mentioned earlier in the thread. I just wish I could remember where I saw the pictures, or how exactly it was done.

[90vntShadow]

Could it be done on the inside of the car? Along the inside edges of the body along
the floor?

[cm961]

Someone needs to put up part drawings so we can fab up parts for strength like the ones in the barracuda link above. Or even make and sell the parts. Reading about all the aparent strength of the rocker panels scares me because mine are both cut out right now.

Pete

[Reaper1]

Sure it could be done inside the car, but the carpet won't fit propperly afterward...

[135SoHc]

so does anyone have a decent underbody shot of a p body rag top showing what all was done to reinforce it.

this topic is one that interests me in regards to stiffening up the body as a whole in non obtrusive ways

[The Pope]

the converts have massive frame rails running down the whole side on each side. Trying to do side exhaust exhaust is crazy. They have a frame rail where that car buckled. Given the impact that car took, it could have been worse, and I would rather it give there anyway. If you extend the rail and the frame gives under your seat vs behind it, you will be crushed. The frame as is keeps the passenger seat rails in place. Imagine if he added a frame connector and the frame gave under his legs and cut them off hitting the dash. Or no crumple and the passenger goes through the seat belts and out the window. You people should consider the ballence in safety the factory was dealing with before just judging this. Going to add a roll cage? That will be safe. But with no crumple zones to absorb impact you must add a 5 way seat belt. Then with bars around your head always where a seat belt. Your arms will also get tossed more as the impact on your body goes up in a roll cage car, that means side nets to keep your arm from going out the window, etc. Look at it this way, could have been steam rolled flat in an Accord.

[reliantwagon]

the left front frame rail on my 91 daytona is mooshy toward the back... anybody else have this problem? theres no visible rust through the floor pan from the bottom veiw i talked to some hole at the faulkner auto body dump today and asked about he all he seemed to want to do is get a customer...

[Reaper1]

There is material added as The Pope says, however it isn't that thick and it is mearly riveted in. They kind of resemble the old "torque boxes" of the muscle cars. Honestly the convertible P-bodies are HORRIBLE. They didn't add nearly enough material to make them torsionally rigid enough.

The company that did the limited number of convertible G-bodies had the right idea. They added a cross brace under the car as well as a superstructure connecting the b-pillars laterally as well as cross bracing those. I never got to ride in one(yet...I would LOVE to find another one!!), but to me THAT is the way to go!

[jimduchek]

Reaper1: Can you get pics of that? Does anyone on here have one? These cars are all basically the same, so it'd be pretty interesting to see how they did that.

[Reaper1]

What? Pictures of the 'vert G-body set-up? It'll be a little while before I can. I have the pamphlet that has this stuff highlighted in it, but I'm in Daytona Beach right now at school. I'm going to the Rolex 24 this weekend, so it might have to be next weekend before I can get to it...