finished my cheap oil catch can - 4 1/2 weeks later

[lookin]

Even new NA engines get a tiny amount of blow-by, and think they also have less than even a small amount of actual vacuum in the crankcase.

[Screamin4banger]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lookin Even new NA engines get a tiny amount of blow-by, and think they also have less than even a small amount of actual vacuum in the crankcase.

Don't take what I said as personal or argumentative...

I was just pointing out that when you sit down and design an internal combustion engine - your boss probably won't be happy when you show him/her the design and say:
"I designed a motor that should put out about 100HP - it would prolly do 130HP if I could figure out how to keep the cylinder pressure in the cylinder pushing the piston down - but this is good enough; I'm going home. When do we start on the tooling for the new engine plant?"

Meh... I was never good with Japanese engines.

None of my 2.2's had blow-by until after 134K
or my Olds motors
or the Turbo Buick
or even my BB Mopar

I've had plenty of motors that DID have blow-by
They were all worn and are now long gone

I just started getting blow-by in my 3.8 Windstar - and I can feel the difference from how it was when I bought it. It's not 200HP anymore, I can tell you that.

so, I just passed along what I know...

That's all

BTW, I did like the catch can

[lookin]

No problem screamin.

I know people hate hearing it, but my 3.0 at 120K miles, was getting really tired fast. It had good oil pressure, but the manifold vacuum was below par, and the oil consumption and blow-by was rapidly getting worse. It was also getting less and less gas mileage. It then got very noisy at startup, and nothing I tried helped that.

As a last resort before getting rings and valves, I treated it with Auto-RX, and man the results have been amazing! The manifold vac is up to new OE spec. It doesn't consume oil anymore, and I am now getting 25 mpg without even babying it. It has gobs more power too, and it no longer has that infamous 3.0 HLA clatter at startup, ... just blissful smooth silence. :)

[Screamin4banger]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lookin No problem screamin. I know people hate hearing it, but my 3.0 at 120K miles, was getting really tired fast. It had good oil pressure, but the manifold vacuum was below par, and the oil consumption and blow-by was rapidly getting worse. It was also getting less and less gas mileage. It then got very noisy at startup, and nothing I tried helped that. As a last resort before getting rings and valves, I treated it with Auto-RX, and man the results have been amazing! The manifold vac is up to new OE spec. It doesn't consume oil anymore, and I am now getting 25 mpg without even babying it. It has gobs more power too, and it no longer has that infamous 3.0 HLA clatter at startup, ... just blissful smooth silence. :)

Hmmm... maybe I'll give it a try.

Thats hand lotion with a little dish-soap mixed in right?
Sorry, couldn't resist... Thats what the MSDS for AutoRX pretty much says

[lookin]

Oh you .

Hey it works like magic whatever it is. I honestly feel it is the best money I ever spent on my van.

[Screamin4banger]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lookin Oh you . Hey it works like magic whatever it is. I honestly feel it is the best money I ever spent on my van.

OK, I'll give it another look. Maybe it will get rid of the lifter-tick that just started.

[lookin]

It totally will. Just follow directions exactly, and be patient. It doesn't work overnight.

One of the most noticeable performance increases, I ever got from one modification, was when I installed an under-drive pulley. They are rated to yield between 10 and 15 whp on the dyno. The Auto-Rx treatments results, that I am still getting by the way, feel like way more than I got from the UDP.

It just keeps on improving over time too. Terrific stuff really. :)

[c2xejk]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lookin One of the most noticeable performance increases, I ever got from one modification, was when I installed an under-drive pulley. They are rated to yield between 10 and 15 whp on the dyno.

3L UDP's are worth way less than 10-15 whp... When I tested it, it was ~4whp off peak. (ie. no change in peak hp.) For the complete write-up see Dyne testing

[Ondonti]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lookin OK thanks. :) But if the rings and ring lands are clean, wont the gas 'pressure' be able to expand the rings, by pushing through the little notches that run along them? I mean isn't the combustion gas pressure, in part, pushing against minor .... normal ... crank case pressure what makes them expand and embed in the cylinder walls to seal? That is why I thought, even a small amount of vacuum, would be detrimental to ring seal. Am I like, tooooootally wrong .... fer sure?

It works backwards from what you were thinking. If what you were thinking was right, then 1000psi in the crankcase would help offset the 1000ish psi in the cylinder during combustion. But in reality that would mean no pressure differential between the top and bottom of the ring, and therefore it would have no reason to expand, or push down on the ringland of the piston to seal. vacuum in the crankcase helps keep the rings in place even when you dont have combustion happening, and improves sealing during combustion.

[lookin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by c2xejk 3L UDP's are worth way less than 10-15 whp... When I tested it, it was ~4whp off peak. (ie. no change in peak hp.) For the complete write-up see Dyne testing

Really? Only 4 whp Ed? :) Dang. Well, regardless, that was one of the few mods that my partner actually noticed. It was one of those, "OK what did you do to the van now?", days. I regapped the plugs at the time though come to think of it.

Man! That thread you linked to Ed. Hu-eee! The fun never stops.

[lookin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ondonti It works backwards from what you were thinking. If what you were thinking was right, then 1000psi in the crankcase would help offset the 1000ish psi in the cylinder during combustion. But in reality that would mean no pressure differential between the top and bottom of the ring, and therefore it would have no reason to expand, or push down on the ringland of the piston to seal. vacuum in the crankcase helps keep the rings in place even when you dont have combustion happening, and improves sealing during combustion.

Ooooh, .... OK, .... Thank you. :)

So then do you think my Kahootin valve needs to be recalibrated?

[RoadWarrior222]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Screamin4banger Hmmm... maybe I'll give it a try. Thats hand lotion with a little dish-soap mixed in right? Sorry, couldn't resist... Thats what the MSDS for AutoRX pretty much says

MMO is something like coleman gas/kerosene/BBQ lighter fluid and varsol and seafoam is like varsol plus isopropyl alcohol.

Me I just stick a few ounces of iso or varsol through the gas tank every now and again, or run a quart of varsol in the oil for 15 mins before changing it.

[lookin]

OK then. A few posts back I said the following.

Quote:

Originally Posted by me IMO "a real vacuum in the crankcase" as you speak of, would resist piston upstroke, which would not be good for obvious reasons, .... including ..... the repetitive spikes in vacuum traction caused by piston upstroke, .... that could actually increase blow-by. The same could even adversely affect both ring and cylinder bore .... oil film distribution .... to decrease ring seal even as it also increases both ring and cylinder wear. I believe that one important part of PCV, is the maintaining of proper crankcase gas pressure, and either too much, or too little like an actual vacuum, will cause all sorts of problems in addition to those I theorized above. For example the constant thump thump thump of vacuum spikes, as the pistons move up and down, may even also trash engine seals over time. Our engines were not designed to deal with such an issue, and keeping the PCV system functionally as close to OE as possible is the best policy .... IMO. :)

Maybe I am wrong about this. Please consider the following though.

I can agree, that an actual small amount of crankcase vacuum, would promote ring seal on combustion down stroke.

There is however the same CC vacuum present, as another piston is heading back up on exhaust stroke with an exhaust valve wide open, and there and then cylinder gas pressure is not nearly as high, especially if you have a longer duration cam as some here have.

Here is an additional consideration I was thinking of.

If the same engine has poor ring seal, because the rings are coked or they were not fully embedded and the cylinder walls are glazed, which is why some here may be considering the vac pump Ed mentioned, then this 'elevated' pressure differential becomes a concern in the manner I refer to in my above post.

So we are also talking about 3Ls that either have a bit of age, with some wear and or accumulated carbon and varnish, or those with very poor ring seal for mechanical reasons. Many within either case, are also running oil that is way too thick, as a band aid, and I think that goo can be sucked out of the ring packs, because it really cannot penetrate worth beans and stick to them, on even a good day.

Just my less than expert opinion. :)

[lookin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by RoadWarrior222 MMO is something like coleman gas/kerosene/BBQ lighter fluid and varsol and seafoam is like varsol plus isopropyl alcohol. Me I just stick a few ounces of iso or varsol through the gas tank every now and again, or run a quart of varsol in the oil for 15 mins before changing it.

I think you would be better off adding a touch of 'hand lotion with a little dish-soap' myself.

[RoadWarrior222]

Neutrogena and Sunlight or Ponds intensive care and Dawn?