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post #1 of 7 Old 05-09-2017, 07:00 PM Thread Starter
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Thumbs up 85 dodge 600 won't even idle now

Just replaced all of the old vacuum lines that are plastic on my 85 Dodge 600 rag top, 2.2 turbo. Also replaced the map sensor on the ECM. Before I started all of this work the car ran, but it was really rich, run you out of the garage. Now after this work it won't idle or run at all.
1. If you disconnect the ECM, do they loose the program and have to be reprogramed ?

2. Would the wrong map sensor cause this ? I went by the vacuum diagram on the under side of the hood. The only thing is the diagram shows 4 vacuum connections and my throttle body only has 3. They show the PCV tied in with vacuum supply to the throttle body, but there is no such connection point to do this. My PVC goes to the air filter box. Any ideas or help greatly appreciated. Can I bring up the codes even if engine won't run ?
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post #2 of 7 Old 05-09-2017, 07:42 PM
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Re: 85 dodge 600 won't even idle now

Yes you can retrieve fault codes even if the car will not run.
OBD1 Codes Retrieval-Chrysler 1983-1995 vehicles

Running Black Rich and then changing the Map Sensor and Vacuum Lines and now the car will not run sounds to me like a vacuum issue to the Map.
Be sure all vacuum lines are routed/connected/secured properly.
Be sure you installed the correct Map Sensor for a Turbo car.

The PCV valve must be connected to engine vacuum, the line from the PCV to the Air Cleaner is the Breather Tube to draw in fresh air.


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post #3 of 7 Old 05-10-2017, 03:58 PM Thread Starter
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Re: 85 dodge 600 won't even idle now

Thanks for the reply naj. I went over to my garage today, put the old map back on the ECM, and it fired right up. Still idling rough, so the replacement map is the wrong one as you said. So I checked for any codes that are coming up, and now I'm getting code 12, and code 54. "Loss of back up memory power, and 54 is "Distributor pickup sync circuit has a fault. The pickup and rotor and cap are new. I have both plugs for the pick up connected correctly. Any ideas. I had the negative battery terminal disconnected most of the winter. Sounds like the ECM needs to be Flashed and has lost program maybe, I don't have a clue about the fault with the Distributor pickup circuit??
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post #4 of 7 Old 05-10-2017, 05:06 PM
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Re: 85 dodge 600 won't even idle now

The logic module (ECU) will not forget its programming if unplugged from the car or battery is disconnected. It will however forget any stored fault codes each time it is disconnected from power.

Fault code 12 is totally normal and expected every time you disconnect the power/battery. It will eventually go away after you start and run the car several times.

A 54 can actually be a number of things. When this one appears, it runs rough because the logic module will guess at injector timing. In my experience this code gets stored when there is a problem somewhere in the HEP circuit. A 'problem' can be a lot of different things so the code is really more of a point in the right direction rather than an actual 'here is the problem'.

First, the 84 and 85 distributor is different than an 86+, so is the HEP. So confirm that you have the right distributor, the right HEP and all the connections throughout the complete HEP circuit are good. I know this might sound silly, but I have worked on cars that ran poorly because during a repair one part or another was swapped during a service and it was the wrong part. Also TBI distributors are DIFFERENT than turbo distributors.

Many aftermarket HEPs are garbage by the way, and many of us have had them fail right out of the box or not far down the road. Sure there might be some exceptions but you'll never go wrong with a Chrysler HEP and it will last. The HEP shares a ground with the CTS and other sensors, so you have to check this circuit from end to end, of course it sure helps to have a wiring diagram. If you don't have a FSM, we can also provide you the wiring diagrams you need.

The logic module has a habit in cars that are not run often or parked for long periods of getting a little cold connection or two at the red/blue connectors. Its amazing how many cars get fixed by just removing the logic module, checking and cleaning the pins, then adding some dielectric grease to the red/blue connectors. The dielectric helps to prevent future corrosion as well as forming a moisture barrier that helps maintain the connection while parked or not being driven much.

Check those engine grounds! There is a big fat one at the drivers side front of the cylinder head. It leads into the front charge harness. Make sure it is connected to the head and the bolt is tight. Make sure the intake manifold to firewall ground strap is present and tight, that will make them go nuts for sure. There is also a supplemental grounding strap that goes over the passenger motor mount and one from the negative battery terminal over to the inner fender well, just behind the intake of the power module/behind the battery.

There is also a fuel injection harness ground, this two black wire ground is along the fuel rail, and is attached under the fuel rail mounting bolt typically. It's an important one but would not cause a code 54.

It is not possible to plug the HEP in incorrectly, the connectors are made different to prevent this.

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post #5 of 7 Old 05-10-2017, 05:13 PM
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Re: 85 dodge 600 won't even idle now

Quote:
Originally Posted by ILIKESHELBYS View Post
The logic module (ECU) will not forget its programming if unplugged from the car or battery is disconnected. It will however forget any stored fault codes each time it is disconnected from power.

Fault code 12 is totally normal and expected every time you disconnect the power/battery. It will eventually go away after you start and run the car several times.

A 54 can actually be a number of things. When this one appears, it runs rough because the logic module will guess at injector timing. In my experience this code gets stored when there is a problem somewhere in the HEP circuit. A 'problem' can be a lot of different things so the code is really more of a point in the right direction rather than an actual 'here is the problem'.

First, the 84 and 85 distributor is different than an 86+, so is the HEP. So confirm that you have the right distributor, the right HEP and all the connections throughout the complete HEP circuit are good. I know this might sound silly, but I have worked on cars that ran poorly because during a repair one part or another was swapped during a service and it was the wrong part. Also TBI distributors are DIFFERENT than turbo distributors.

Many aftermarket HEPs are garbage by the way, and many of us have had them fail right out of the box or not far down the road. Sure there might be some exceptions but you'll never go wrong with a Chrysler HEP and it will last. The HEP shares a ground with the CTS and other sensors, so you have to check this circuit from end to end, of course it sure helps to have a wiring diagram. If you don't have a FSM, we can also provide you the wiring diagrams you need.

The logic module has a habit in cars that are not run often or parked for long periods of getting a little cold connection or two at the red/blue connectors. Its amazing how many cars get fixed by just removing the logic module, checking and cleaning the pins, then adding some dielectric grease to the red/blue connectors. The dielectric helps to prevent future corrosion as well as forming a moisture barrier that helps maintain the connection while parked or not being driven much.

Check those engine grounds! There is a big fat one at the drivers side front of the cylinder head. It leads into the front charge harness. Make sure it is connected to the head and the bolt is tight. Make sure the intake manifold to firewall ground strap is present and tight, that will make them go nuts for sure. There is also a supplemental grounding strap that goes over the passenger motor mount and one from the negative battery terminal over to the inner fender well, just behind the intake of the power module/behind the battery.

There is also a fuel injection harness ground, this two black wire ground is along the fuel rail, and is attached under the fuel rail mounting bolt typically. It's an important one but would not cause a code 54.

It is not possible to plug the HEP in incorrectly, the connectors are made different to prevent this.
Could not have said it better myself.

Check your PM's.
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post #6 of 7 Old 05-10-2017, 05:39 PM
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Re: 85 dodge 600 won't even idle now

If it turns out your Code 54 issue is not related to a poor ground or corroded connector terminals and you need a new HEP and prefer a Mopar...
The Mopar part # is 5213524.
It is NS1 (discontinued) from Chrysler however there are a couple on eBay and a couple on RearCounter.com.
I have had experience with one of those sellers, RPN.
I purchased a NOS clutch cable at a very good price and they were very friendly and shipped quickly.
The "other" seller wanted twice the price for the same clutch cable so I would steer clear of them.

https://www.rearcounter.com/5213524-parts465297.html

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mopar-Distri...9UYm55&vxp=mtr

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post #7 of 7 Old 05-12-2017, 05:41 PM Thread Starter
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Re: 85 dodge 600 won't even idle now

Thanks for the information on these sellers
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