Injector problems after sitting 10 years

[MO-E-Bodyman]

I'm trying to help my nephew with his recent purchase but it's been quite awhile since I've done much work on these cars.

It's a '87 CSX that has been sitting about 10 years. He has replaced the fuel tank, sender, and fuel pump, and flushed the fuel lines out. It's getting fuel to the fuel rail and voltage to the injectors but it isn't getting fuel to run. So I'm assuming the injectors are stuck. The fuel system was really gunked up.

I called the Dodge dealer and new stock injectors will cost about $220 for a set of 4. However I can buy a set of P4529495 +40 injectors for $156. The parts guy thinks these were used with the discontinued 'Super 60' kit.

What I need to know is can these be used as stock replacements? The parts guy seems to think so from what he was able to find out. He did call Dodge tech but wasn't able to find out anything definate.

Any help would be appreciated.
TIA,
Dallas

[Dr. Johny Dodge]

if you can afford to put them on a shelf till you have much more motor than stock scoop em the price is really good but those are a bit too much "race" for a stock motor

just +20's are rich enough to get rude looks from people passing the driveway while idleing the car

check the sticky thread -20#'s thread for a better idea how much motor the +40's support

those basically go with a custom callibration and a 3 bar map sensor

you can prob find a good set of used injectors if you post a wanted thread

there are also shops that can rebuild the ones you have

[tryingbe]

Putting +40% in your stock car will make your car run 40% rich all the time! It'll kill the engine in a hurry.

There are places that clean and flow your injectors, maybe you should check them out?

[detobias]

used stock 89+ TI injectors sell all the time on the Classifieds for between 0$ - 50$ / set

edit 33# injectors from 2.5T is what yu want, equivalent to "TII"

[MO-E-Bodyman]

Ok. The CSX has the intercooler and the different type intake. (It's called 2 piece intake, I think? Sorry, been a long time.) So, is this motor t1 or t2?

Another question, how do you get the injector rail off? It hits the intake.

Thanks again,
Dallas

[ILIKESHELBYS]

Its considered a T2 engine. The most economical path to a good repair is to find used injectors in the proper size or to send what you have out to a place that rebuilds and cleans them. I have done this twice using a place called "Witch Hunter Performance" on the West coast. I believe I pay under $100 to get for repaired to like new performance. They also provide a before and after flow sheet so you can see how bad they were and how well balanced they are after the service. Anything less than the proper size injector will just cause you troubles with mixture, drivability, and a new custom cal is what is needed to correct it. +20s on any standard engine will cause it to run rich some of the time but mostly at WOT when these engines use only a table to determine the fuel mix...all sensors ignored during WOT. An engine in good tune with all sensors working can tune out extra fuel via the O2 sensor when not at WOT.

[ILIKESHELBYS]

The injectors can be removed with the manifold in the car but it is a little bit tricky. Many suggest its best to split the manifold to avoid hitting the injector tips on the mani during remove and install. If the two piece gasket is fresh and doesn't rip when the manifold is parted, you can easily get away with just loosening the bolts so you can get maybe 1/8 to 1/4" of extra clearance to lift out the rail and injectors together.

Else, you can remove the injectors one at a time by starting at the drivers side and working your way to the passenger side. Its not as hard as it really looks if you just take your time and look at the puzzle. I can take mine out as a unit by first removing the port nipples on the front of the mani, then the rail can be slightly raised and then moved to the left about an inch (I believe it may be right) turned slightly and then simply lifted out. It is the slight turn and the move to the side that makes it possible.

[tryingbe]

Quote:

Originally Posted by ILIKESHELBYS Many suggest its best to split the manifold to avoid hitting the injector tips on the mani during remove and install. If the two piece gasket is fresh and doesn't rip when the manifold is parted, you can easily get away with just loosening the bolts so you can get maybe 1/8 to 1/4" of extra clearance to lift out the rail and injectors together.

That's the first time I heard of it and I would not recommand it at all. For easier to take off the fuel pressor regulator and/or remove the valve cover to give you the extra room than take apart the 2 piece intake manifold.

[onerippinturbo2]

those injectors are +20's not +40's
just order a set of 804 injectors for it
p4452804, these injectors can be used as stock replacements sold in sets of 4
p4529495,+20% extra high flow injectors sold in sets of 4
p4532586AB +40% super 60 injectors sold indivdually
all are still available through mopar and if your dealer tells you he cant get them, drop me a pm, i'll get them for you for less then anyone else can and ship them to your doorstep.

[spudwiser67]

or you could try rockauto I got a set awhile back for like $47 shipped., stock replacments seem to work better than the old ones.

[GLHNSLHT2]

as Tryingbe said take the FPR and VC off, then once the rail is loose you can pull the injector clips and pull the rail back to leave the injectors in the intake then wiggle the rail out.

[MO-E-Bodyman]

Thanks for everyone's help. I'll check on the 804 injectors.
I showed this thread to my nephew so he should be able to get it apart now.
Dallas

[MO-E-Bodyman]

The 804s are on order and my nephew got it apart. So progress is being made.
Thanks for the help,
Dallas

[ILIKESHELBYS]

"That's the first time I heard of it and I would not recommand it at all. For easier to take off the fuel pressor regulator and/or remove the valve cover to give you the extra room than take apart the 2 piece intake manifold."

Yeah....I totally forgot to mention that you do HAVE to take the FPR off and removing the VC also gives you a little more room to work. I leave the VC on now, I've done it more than a few times. There is always some concern about dragging the tips of the injectors over the hole edge of the intake where the injector tip goes in. I've not had this problem since I discovered that if you push the harness and the injector connector behind the fuel rail before trying to remove it. I find this to be waaaaay more easier than removing the clips and wiggling it apart then reversing the order on reassembly. Its not so easy to not drop or sail one of the clips right into the great beyond or another parallel universe where it can't easily be found.

It's really a matter of personal preference though all these suggestions are tried and true for the most part we have all tried it a number of ways. Point that is important here is that you're careful to not bang the injector tips, and new rubber seals are SUGGESTED when you take the injector out of the fuel rail. If the seals are older, when you reinstall them, they are probably rather hard and/or brittle and MAY leak under pressure...a little or quite a bit. So put in new seals just to be safe..and Oh! BTW, when you put in new seals it is very difficult most the time to get the injector back into the rail unless you've got a good working angle where you can apply an appropriate force to get it in place.

[MO-E-Bodyman]

Update; It runs!
He got the new injectors back in and it started right up and sounds good. He had a problem with the fan not coming on when it got up to temp but that was just a problem with corrosion in the relay.
The engine light is on, though, and it's a code 23. So we will have to check that out next.
Thanks for the help,
Dallas