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Turbo Dodge Help Urgent help when something goes wrong with your Dodge and you can't figure out what the problem is. Troubleshooting help and the place to post when you're stuck with a broken car and have to get to work the next day.

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Old 11-05-2012, 06:44 AM   #16
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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Do not forget that your FPR operates on vacuum and pressure because you have a turbo car.
Fuel pressure will/should increase 1 PSI over Static for every 1 lb of boost.

If the car does not have a boost gauge tee a vacuum/pressure gauge inline with the FPR or Map, tape the gauge to the windshield and go for a ride.

Actually you also need to do this anyway with the fuel pressure gauge and vacuum/pressure gauge to read total fuel pressure while driving.

Once you have the fuel pressure issue corrected...
You will only loose boost(assuming the turbo is ok)if you have a boost leak in the charge piping or the wastegate is stuck open.
Disconnect the line from the wastegate and go for a ride.
(Be careful, there will be no wastegate control so do not allow the system to go to overboost shutdown)
If you boost properly now the problem is the wastegate is opening too soon or a wastegate control issue.
If you still do not boost properly look for a boost leak in the charge piping.
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Old 11-05-2012, 02:11 PM   #17
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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Can you describe the workings of the wastgate...like is it normally open so the car will not overboost if it fails...then it is drawn closed by vacuum, or is it normally closed and is opened by vacuum?
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Old 11-06-2012, 09:25 AM   #18
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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First a little explanation on engine basics and air pressure.

1)An internal combustion engine is nothing more than an air pump.
2)An internal combustion engine always uses up its air supply before its fuel supply.
3)The more air you can get in and the faster you can get it out the more power you create by using more of your available fuel.
4)This is why newer cars with DOHC Multivalve engines create much more power while getting better fuel economy, they breath much better and fuel control is much more precise so nothing is wasted.

Air Pressure
1)High pressure always moves to low pressure in an attempt to equalize.
2)The engine creates low pressure(vacuum, lower than atmospheric).
When the throttle is opened outside air(atmospheric pressure)rushes in to attempt to fill the void of lower pressure.
(Vacuum , below atmospheric is measured in Inches Of Mercury.." HG)
(Pressure, above atmospheric is measures in Boost, Pounds Per Square Inch..PSI)
3)The amount of air that enters the engine depends on engine size/design/age/wear on engine components and actual atmospheric conditions.
Again on ALL engines the air supply will be depleted before the fuel supply.
4)Turbochargers and Superchargers increase the atmospheric pressure in the Intake Manifold so when the intake valve opens More air than just atmospheric rushes into the cylinder.
5)As boost increases(more available air and increased temps)you have to be sure you are also supplying fuel and keeping combustion chamber temps down or you will go lean(not enough fuel) and either melt pistons or destory pistons from detonation(another topic)
6)On a normally stock engine the engine controller can read up to 2 Bar or 14.5 Lbs of boost(14.5 PSI of atmospheric pressure) and add fuel needed to that point.
Above that the controller can no longer read Map voltage and add fuel so the controller goes into overboost shutdown to prevent lean conditions and engine damage.
Ironic though, overboost shutdown is violent and will blow head gaskets and break piston ring lands so both...lean and shutdown want to be avoided.
7)Boost levels are controlled by the controller opening the wastegate to allow exhaust gases to exit without turning the turbine side of the turbo.
8)Boost levels are set lower on a non-intercooled car beacuse combustion chamber temps will be higher and may cause detonation.

The Wastegate
The wastegate is normally closed and is opened by + pressure(boost).
When the wastegate is closed exhaust gases are routed thru the turbine side of the turbo, as the engine rpm increases and exhaust flow speed/volume increase the turbine turns faster which turns the compressor side of the turbo faster.
The faster it turns the more air is compressed and the pressure increases and more air enters the engine allowing more fuel to be used thus creating more power.

Hopefully this explanation helped cleared things up and did not create more confusion.
Any questions Please ask and remember, my PM box is always open if you want to ask out of the public eye.

If you would like to see pics of the different turbo's and wastegates go to...
Donavans Dodge Garage and click on Turbo Database.
Donovan's Dodge Garage
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Old 11-07-2012, 08:54 PM   #19
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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What would be the best/affordable service manual to get for this car? I am hoping to get the fuel pressure gauge etc tomorrow from autozone and get working Friday. I have the weekend off. If anyone is near ohio 45885 and would like to stop by and share your wisdom that would be great.
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Old 11-08-2012, 05:49 AM   #20
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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You can find the FSM's on eBay.

ALL 3 FSM'S
Like New 1988 Chrysler Service Manual Set Front Wheel Drive Cars Dodge Plymouth | eBay

ELECTRICAL,FUEL,EMISSIONS
1988 Dodge Chrysler Front Wheel Drive Car Electrical Service Manual SY1256 | eBay

WIRING DIAGRAMS
1988 Chrysler Service Manual Wiring Diagrams FWD Cars Repair Guide | eBay

ENGINE,CHASSIS,BODY
88 Chrysler Dodge Front Wheel Drive Service Manual 1988 | eBay


Chrysler 1988 Service Manual Engine Chassis Body Front Wheel Drive Car | eBay
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Old 11-10-2012, 10:26 AM   #21
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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Ok, I picked up the fuel pressure test kit from autozone ($150 deposit, oriely deposit is $110)

Replaced fuel filter.

Fuel pressure regulator is bad. Pressure is 24 @ idle, squeeze return line and it goes up past 60.

I am going to do a compression test next and a friend is supposed to bring a timing light this afternoon.
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Old 11-10-2012, 11:38 AM   #22
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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Compression is 120-122 on all 4 cylinders.
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Old 11-10-2012, 12:26 PM   #23
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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What plugs would be suggested, I will likely keep the car stock.

Tag calls for champion RN12YC. It has RN14YC plugs in it now. Is that ok?

Are champions suggested? Do you guys prefer ngk or autolite?
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Old 11-10-2012, 08:21 PM   #24
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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my favorite, and probably really good in a non-intercooled car are the Autolite AR51's. I run them in all my TD's. They're as cold as an RN6*** champion but with their cut back electrode run smooth as glass without causing detonation and have a better flame propagation. My car barely has any hydro carbon emmisions with +40% larger injectors, a 2.5, ported top end, and 3" straight pipe side exit exhaust. I contribute that a lot to the plugs and how well they burn the fuel mix.
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Old 11-14-2012, 03:44 PM   #25
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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The fuel pressure regulator came today. Once installed the car starts quicker...used to take at least 2 tries, now it starts immediately. The car ran very well then started shuddering and code 13. I went and bought some new vac lines and cleaned out the t's. So far no more 13 and the car runs great. I still have to figure out waht went wrong with the brakes.

Thanks again for all the help/advice.
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Old 11-14-2012, 07:31 PM   #26
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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Glad to hear the driveability issues are corrected.

What is wrong with the brakes?
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Old 11-14-2012, 09:51 PM   #27
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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Recap: I put in the new master cylinder and had crappy brakes until I removed the front wheels so I could get a socket onto the bleeders, bled front and brakes were great. Last week I we braking hard and the pedal dropped. I smelled old brake fluid. I bled the brakes and pumped the pedal to see if any fluid would leak...but the pedal is still soft. It is easy to press the brake pedal and no brakes until the bottom of the pedal...like there is air somewhere...but I can't find any leak.
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Old 11-15-2012, 05:31 AM   #28
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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You need to bleed all 4 wheels,the system is a "split diagonal" system meaning that the R/R and L/F are one one brake hydraulic circuit and the L/R and R/F are on the other.
The bleeding sequence is R/R, L/F, L/R, R/F.
If the fluid was run dry the master cylinder needs to be bled first.
If you do not get strong fluid flow from both MC ports the MC must be replaced.
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Old 11-16-2012, 06:13 AM   #29
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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I had bled all 4 wheels, but I did lf,rf,lr,rr.

I forgot to mention the brake and P lights are on. The resevoir never went dry. I will buy another jug of brake fluid and bleed the correct pattern and also bleed until I see clean fluid not just no bubbles. I bleed with a jar and a line down in fluid from the bleeder. Usually pump brake pedal until 2 or 3 pumps without seeing bubbles. I will keep going until fluid is clean and new so I am sure there are no air pockets.

It seems to me that since the brakes were fine, then in one occurance the pedal got soft and I smelled old fluid that fluid came out and air got in. Does that sound right or am I missing somethiing?
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Old 11-17-2012, 06:24 AM   #30
Re: Help me bring 88 New Yorker Turbo back to life  
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Sound like you are doing everything correctly.
Bleed again and post back with your results but I still suggest bleeding the MC first because of the issues you are having.

I bought one of these at Napa for under $10.00, makes bleeding the MC very easy.
http://www.dormanproducts.com/p-19543-13911.aspx
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