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Turbo Dodge Help Urgent help when something goes wrong with your Dodge and you can't figure out what the problem is. Troubleshooting help and the place to post when you're stuck with a broken car and have to get to work the next day.

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Old 11-19-2012, 05:46 PM   #1
88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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Young Gun is keeping the peace
Sorry if its the wrong section... I've been dormant for awhile with a bad head and a unwillingness to do anything. Quick background as to why I'm having trouble.

-Wanted a 2nd car to use to deliver pizza.
-Bought this 88 shelby z with little knowledge about these cars and not alot of wrench time.
-Had a bearing issue Yeah didn't know about it upon purchase
-With help of a local I got a 2.5 T1
-Dropped that in with the t2 top end and a MBC and a auto 2.5 t1 smec
-Lots of detonation + hitting overboost shutdown like an idiot with maybe 600 miles before i had bad valve train noise + Found out the fuel pump was running only 40-45 psi at idle
-Cam journal wear+bad valve seats. Just bought a new roller head for roughly the same $$


When I bought the head the plan was to do the 20 psi mod with the +20's, LC-1, Walbro 255, 2.5 in exhaust that I already had. Still need the computer (which ever one I need idk which), AFPR then I'm unsure of the rest as its starting to add up to more then I want to spend. On top of that the other day I went out to PB blast the gas tank straps and I poked a hole through the frame or the pinch weld area near the rear wheel. I got severely depressed at the rust rate of this car as it has the typical fred flintstone going on on the driver side and just the overall grossness underneath the whole car.

Planned on fixing it and driving it a bit and getting a reliable car that isn't rusted this bad. I guess my question is what would you do? or what are my options as it ran with the 2.5 t1 with detonation and I don't REALLY want to sell it like that.



other negatives I have going on or more work to do
-NY winter sucks working in outside
-Probably needs the front pass. side wheel bearing done although I could sell it with this
-Non turbo pass. side long cv axle, I have a intermediate shaft with cv shaft just not on there
-more rust
-Need to Frankenstein the exhaust some or paid to get it so it doesn't bang around everywhere
-Driver side T top black trim that is on the back side of the door is broken off
-I'm demotivated with this specific car yet I still love them as a whole
-Crappy tires on eh looking 15"ers and the stock crabs have dry rotted tires on them so buying tires either way and it'll cost $$ which I'm trying to minimize
- Says in the 20 psi mod to get new fuel lines.. steel or rubber? Cause idk if I wanna tackle the steel lines especially with all the rust( won't need to worry if i choose not to do 20 psi mod) and aswell as I don't have nor want to do the car build part of the 20 psi mod:
poly front and rear engine mounts
Poly A arm bushings and sway bar bushings
new struts and shocks, KYB gr2 at least
1 negitive camber up front at least, no positive camber computer alignments!

-God knows if anyone read this far in my long rant. I can add pictures so maybe you'll read the text??


Any thoughts and comments are appreciated. Just want to figure out what I'm going to do.
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Old 11-19-2012, 07:53 PM   #2
Re: 88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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Dr. Johny Dodge is keeping our cars runningDr. Johny Dodge is keeping our cars running
ya , I hear you

problem with these cars and I speak from experiance is that they pretty much suck as basic used cars if all you want is transportation

that said they make excellent hobby cars and once rebuilt from stem to stern they do much better

I bought an 85 turismo back in 88 when it was only 3 years old
within 1 year just about every mechanical assembly in the car had failed - it only had
50 000 KM on it when I bought it for 55 hun

however , once I replaced everything with shelby charger parts - freash ones mostly ,- and converted it to the old style log turbo motor it got much much better

then , and only then did the real fun begin

but , as a carbed drive it to work used car it was a total fail

t-g I had my hand me down v8 fairmont at the time too or I'd have been screwed - the only thing it ever asked for was a new fuel pump in the 5-6 years I had it
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If you don't have the time or the money to do it right the first time , How the hell are you gonna get it right the second time ?
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Old 11-20-2012, 07:29 AM   #3
Re: 88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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detobias is keeping our cars running
+1 TDs can be a love/hate relationship,

like most hobbies involving old rusty metal, brittle old plastic, PO's hack jobs, dry shrunken rubber, etc

to minimize the hate I suggest:
1. get it running properly with the 2.5 in (essentially) stock trim
2. perform the minimum undercar maintenance to assure safety (brakes tires etc)

run it like this for a while as you sort out smaller issues (t top trim) ..
and decide if you are going to
1 tackle the rust issues, or
2 just drive it, and enjoy it, as it slowly decays away...

actually 'quickly decays away' if yur driving pizzas in the winter in salty Rochester NY

(lol 88-90 TBI omnis make better winter beaters ...)
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Old 11-20-2012, 06:14 PM   #4
Re: 88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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I have had multiple td's in your exact situation.
You first need to decide for yourself if you are willing and able to get the car to a safe and functional level. If you don't have the will, funds, or resources to do so then I would stop right there before investing anymore time and funds into the vehicle.
I would get the car in a running/driving/ functioning/safe condition and go from there.
As stated above, after you get the car to functioning safe level I would take a look at the opportunity cost of what is left do on the vehicle.
Is the rust something you want to tackle?
Obviously the cost and time involved to do rust repair and other cosmetic fixes can be extensive.
I would not spend any money or time in modding the vehicle until you have the car safe and reliable. Then if the rust is not something you want to tackle, mod the heck out of it, enjoy it and when it has disenegrated to an unsafe point either ship it or part it.
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Old 11-21-2012, 02:44 PM   #5
Re: 88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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Thanks for the input. Just going to put it back to stock by putting the head on and fixing the fuel pump so it runs good.

Now for another question. I dont really want to drop the tank(or sag it as some people say they have done). So could I put a pump inline(before or after?) the fuel filter? or should I just suck it up and drop the tank? Never dropped a tank before but I've read some threads on here.
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Old 11-21-2012, 03:35 PM   #6
Re: 88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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I would suggest dropping the tank and cleaning it out while you have it out of the vehicle. It is worth the extra effort.
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Old 11-21-2012, 04:01 PM   #7
Re: 88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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Dr. Johny Dodge is keeping our cars runningDr. Johny Dodge is keeping our cars running
usually I would agree with what he said ^
but
you mention rust
question is , how rusty is the crossmember under the trunk that the gas tank straps bolt up to ?
if very I'd swap the pump without trying to drop the tank

also , fixing a broken strap stud under the floor is next to impossiable - they are not removeable as they are welded to the crossmember (inside it) before the crossmember is welded to the floor pan
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Old 11-21-2012, 04:56 PM   #8
Re: 88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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Well if its that rusty it isn't too hard to put a new stud in there either.
I had a daytona where I dropped the tank and broke both studs. Car was just a winter beater. A drill, some bolts and a couple tack welds later.... VOILA!
But yes I would assess the amount of rust and hit the bolts with penetrating oil for good measure.
You can squeeze the pump out of the tank with the tank in the car and I would do that at the very least. An inline pump IMO would not be a good idea
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Old 11-21-2012, 11:26 PM   #9
Re: 88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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Originally Posted by turbokid View Post
I would suggest dropping the tank and cleaning it out while you have it out of the vehicle. It is worth the extra effort.
For a car I'm probably selling?

But I think I'll try doing it without removing the tank first as the rust is bad. Already hit it with pb. 1 more days worth of pb to go and we will see.
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Old 11-21-2012, 11:29 PM   #10
Re: 88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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Dr. Johny Dodge is keeping our cars runningDr. Johny Dodge is keeping our cars running
start with the pass side strap and stud - at least if it snaps you still have the filler neck to help hold it up

the stud ripped right out of the crossmember in my Z - on the pass side
I never bothered to fix it , I just never put more than half a tank in the car when filling up

car was to rotted to be worth the effort of replaceing the crossmember
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Old 11-21-2012, 11:34 PM   #11
Re: 88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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start with the pass side strap and stud - at least if it snaps you still have the filler neck to help hold it up

the stud ripped right out of the crossmember in my Z - on the pass side
I never bothered to fix it , I just never put more than half a tank in the car when filling up

car was to rotted to be worth the effort of replaceing the crossmember
thanks for the tip!
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Old 11-22-2012, 12:03 AM   #12
Re: 88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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You said your fuel pump is running at 40-45 psi at idle?

If that is why you are replacing it, I would suggest replacing the fuel filter first, and then seeing if the pressure increases at all. "Static Pressure" on these cars is 55 PSI, at 0 vacuum. IIRC, the fuel pressure drops 1 PSI per 2 in/hg of vaccum. So if your car is running at a typical 18-20 in/hg of vaccum then you are about correct on fuel pressure. 20 in/hg = 10 PSI. I would also suggest running some fuel injector cleaner, or some type of fuel system cleaner. After that is all sorted out, THEN I would look at the pump. They do go out, and often its you who has to change them, but the rest of the system has to be gone through as well to at least make it run correctly and reliably. So you may as well do the small jobs first before you decide to drop 89 bucks on a new pump.
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Old 11-22-2012, 12:29 AM   #13
Re: 88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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Originally Posted by turismolover22 View Post
You said your fuel pump is running at 40-45 psi at idle?

If that is why you are replacing it, I would suggest replacing the fuel filter first, and then seeing if the pressure increases at all. "Static Pressure" on these cars is 55 PSI, at 0 vacuum. IIRC, the fuel pressure drops 1 PSI per 2 in/hg of vaccum. So if your car is running at a typical 18-20 in/hg of vaccum then you are about correct on fuel pressure. 20 in/hg = 10 PSI. I would also suggest running some fuel injector cleaner, or some type of fuel system cleaner. After that is all sorted out, THEN I would look at the pump. They do go out, and often its you who has to change them, but the rest of the system has to be gone through as well to at least make it run correctly and reliably. So you may as well do the small jobs first before you decide to drop 89 bucks on a new pump.
I put a fuel injector cleaner in the tank when I put the 2.5 in to stabilize the fuel some when it had been sitting for awhile..Smoked pretty good for a awhile.. And the first thing I did after finding out about the low fuel pressure was replace the filter and there was no change in the PSI. Honestly I can't remember the exact number but I know it was atleast 10 below 55
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Old 11-22-2012, 02:53 AM   #14
Re: 88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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Dr. Johny Dodge is keeping our cars runningDr. Johny Dodge is keeping our cars running
if it's 10 ish pounds off , I'd wonder if the pick up screen / sock on the pump is cloged up
- ya , another good reason to drop the tank if so , but just pulling the pump first would give you some indication of the condition of the bottom of the tank when you look at the sock

another tip - tie your work light to somthing so it can't fall down and break the bulb when you have a work area full of gas fumes
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Old 11-22-2012, 12:39 PM   #15
Re: 88 shelby Z's fate. You help!!  
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if it's 10 ish pounds off , I'd wonder if the pick up screen / sock on the pump is cloged up
- ya , another good reason to drop the tank if so , but just pulling the pump first would give you some indication of the condition of the bottom of the tank when you look at the sock

another tip - tie your work light to somthing so it can't fall down and break the bulb when you have a work area full of gas fumes
I'll have my buddy there helping but again appreciate it. God if if was just that the sock was clogged which it very well could be considering I accidently ran the tank really low twice and that was after the injector cleaner getting swooshed around in there.. I'll find out tomorrow!!
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