86 carb car timing question

[Canty]

I bought this car and she's in ROUGH shape. The motor runs pretty well and has a new Weber carb. During driving the car "hiccups" but keeps going. Just a lil bump in the rpm and all is normal but it does it a lot. Not consistent but enough to say it is a big problem. It reminds me of when our TD's overboost. How everything just drops out then comes right back. today I checked spark and it was good, unless I have bad plugs. I didn't check those. I also checked timing and this is what I found.
-No mark in the sight window when timing light is used.
-When I turn the motor over to get the mark in the window the distributor is at number one just slightly pointed to number 3.
-Cam sprocket top hole is just behind the engine centerline.
-If I turn the distributor either way the engine begins to die and the mark still is not seen in the sight window.

[Canty]

Update:
Spark plugs are firing. I re-timed the car and got the line and *** in the sight window. But with the coolant temp sensor unplugged and the timing light on the mark moves. Some flashes it is on one side of the window, other flashes it is on the other side and some flashes it is not in the window at all. The car did seem to run better after I timed it except starting was kinda rough. The hiccups are still there too. I am clueless. I have never had one of these carb cars. And I have a feeling this car really is just full of band aids on the issues not actually having problems fixed. Anybody have any ideas? Any at all?

[92TurboTona]

when you retimed the motor were the oil pump tang indentations parallel with the block as this does sound like the dizzy is out of time

[Canty]

I am almost positive it was. You are talking about the groves the distributor slides into...right? I do know that I removed the cap to verify the rotor button was pointed at number 1 when I timed it.

[92TurboTona]

i would recheck base timing on the crank/Int Shaft and the cam and make sure you aren't a tooth off retarded or advanced and check to see where the dizzy rotor is pointing

[detobias]

sounds like te intermediate shaft may be off one tooth..
really doesnt matter, espec. on a TBI car

of course it DOES matter if the cam is off a tooth, so you should check that

jumpy timing would suggest carefully checking the dizzy, shutter wheel integrity, and HEP mounting

a random miss would have me checking the HEP...

(I think I have some spare TBI HEPs and dizzys if ya need...)

any codes?

[NAJ]

You do not unplug the CTS on a carbed car to set/check timing.
Everything is controlled by the spark control computer.
You have to disconnect and plug the vacuum line to the vacuum transducer and ground the closed throttle switch.
Other than that everything else(engine mechanical, secondary ignition) is checked as you would any other car and the timing belt/marks are set the same as the fuel injected cars.

[Canty]

Thanks guys. I will double check tonight after work. Detobias is there a way to check the HEP? How much for one of your good ones?

[92TurboTona]

i think there is a way to check it, JAN can you post up the procedure

[Canty]

NAJ, could you help me out and tell me where the transducer is and where the closed throttle switch is? I apologize, since this is my first carb car I am not sure the location of these items.

[92TurboTona]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Canty NAJ, could you help me out and tell me where the transducer is and where the closed throttle switch is? I apologize, since this is my first carb car I am not sure the location of these items.

the transducer is on the top of the spark computer and the closed throttle switch is located on the driver side carb on top of the throttle bracket

heres a couple good threads here for the carb cars

http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f11...guide-1-a.html

http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f11...nfo-noobs.html

[Canty]

You guys were right. The dizzy was way out. I timed the car looking at the marks on the pulleys and got it all lined up right. The car runs better but I still have that hiccup thing. I am starting to think it is in the carb because it doesnt happen while idling. Only during driving when the gas pedal is pressed. It could be hiccuping then push the clutch and nothing...all smooth. Also, I don't have a closed throttle switch? I have a picture of my carb if I need to post it, but there is NOTHING with wires going to it except the electric choke. Is that a needed item for a manual trans car? Lastly, even though the car runs better, the timing mark is still jumping around. Not nearly as much but still quite a bit. Is that common for carb 2.2's? Again, sorry to be asking so many questions. Thanks for all your help guys.

[92TurboTona]

the hiccups do sound like your carb and by the sound of it you have a 5220 as those were non feedback like the 6520, anyways the hiccup sounds like your squirter may be clogged up or the diaphragm collapsed, does it do it during acceleration, but since it doesnt do that when you disengage the clutch is puzzling

your electric choke is needed for cold starts if you drive in cold weather, i would keep it on there regardess, as far as the jumping around goes, my turismo did that and it purred like a kitten after i put a weber on it

[Canty]

ya, at idle it sounds great. The carb is new but I will check the squirters and diaphragm. The car came with some jet kits. What size jets were used as a stock setting? I am wondering if the previous owner changed them. When I accelerate it pulls well. I really dont notice if it hiccups during accel and if it does it isn't nearly as bad as when I am just maintaining a speed. But ya, I have never heard it during idle or when I push the clutch in like I am rolling to a stop sign or light. I will say the car is still kinda loud so I cant really hear well anyway. Geez...I have a long list of things to fix. Here is a picture of the carb.

my carb by Canty13, on Flickr

[Canty]

I am still having issues even after installing Detobias's HEP. I have replaced everything electrical. Coil, wires, plugs, cap, rotor. A buddy of mine told me to check the distributor for any wobble or play. Under the HEP there is very little to no side to side play. However, there is 2/16 to 3/16th of an inch up and down play through the distributor. How much shaft play is acceptable? I was wondering if that play was enough to "bounce" around and maybe cause misfires.