A Few Newbie Questions

[85gts321]

Hi, my name is Drew and i just got a 85 Lebaron GTS turbo with 36K org miles on it. This will be my DD as I have a 2002 Z28 i can start building. There are a few questions i have about the car since i know nothing about them. I want to have a little fun with the car since i'll be driving it everyday.

1. What is the max the turbo will push?
2. Where do you guys mount a boost gauge? The car has a digital dash with no tach
3. Is it worth putting a BOV on it?
4. I believe the car is non intercooled; should i setup an intercooler?

Any input would be a big help thanks.

[turbomini]

ok first the intake style wil only let you push 10 safely but the computer will hit over boost before that...
2. i mounted mine in my gts above the head light switch.
3.you cant put one on it...
4.you'll have to get a newer style intake and eletronics to intercool it..i'll post pics of mine..

[looneytuner]

Check the parts for sale. "Terry Again" has an MP logic module that will give it a kick in the pants. You will have to switch back to stock when you get emissions checked. 15 minute switch. The lm is behing the passenger kick panel.

[85gts321]

haha no emissions in ohio! And i have been searching the site and what is wrong with the "log style" intake that only lets them hit 10#?

[turbomini]

a engine shot


mine is a 87 with 88 newyorker wirring.

[woodrow Z]

Quote:

Originally Posted by 85gts321 what is wrong with the "log style" intake that only lets them hit 10#?

More boost creates heat. Hence the use of an intercooler to cool the charged air. There is too much heat and not enough cooling with the log. you'll be melting engine parts in no time. My T1 w/log and no intercooler has a boost controller set at 10. Its just enough to play with. Any more boost and I have to change the intake and a bunch more crap.

[bleeddarkblack]

With the TI log intake manifold boost backs up around 15psi anyway. I ran up to 11 and was fine, but overboost spoils every thing. You would have to wire in resistors to fool the map sensor.

[itsbudda]

I'm intercooling my lebaron now (i'm switching from the log to the newer style intake) , and I must say it's not exactly easy. If you plan to do this you should first make sure your Z28 is running good, cause you're gonna need that car for a week or so while your lebaron isn't running.

But as for parts, you'll at least need the new intake, fuel rail, exhaust manifold, and throttle body. You'll also either need a new wiring harness or to modify your existing harness.

I'd post more, but i gotta go to work. Check out the turbo database at thedodgegarage.com

[EvilcowRoland]

36k original miles? That's a nice find! Start by going to Donovan's Dodge Garage and reading up on these turbo cars. That will answer a lot of your questions.

Boost with a log will be physically limited to around 14 PSI because of something called boost stacking. Basically the log intake doesn't flow enough for the turbo, so the pressure will back up in the intake. That's bad for power and bad for your turbo. If you're only looking to push low power with it, it isn't a major issue. But if you want to get the most out of the engine, consider ditching it. Swapping to the later model 89+ intake will also make it infinitely easier to intercool. You can intercool the log setup, but honestly it's so much trouble and the gains so small it wouldn't be worth it.

A BOV won't help your car as is. Your turbo is behind the throttle plate, so when it closes there is no boost left in the system to blow off. If you switch to the later intake then the turbo will be before the throttle. You would then need a BOV.

Overboost shutdown is supposed to be at 14.7 PSI or 2 bars of pressure. That's pretty standard on the later model electronics. With the early electronics it's hit or miss. It depends on the MAP/ECU combination as to when you'll hit the limit. An MP computer and a new Mopar MAP will usually take care of that issue. But before you go trying to find the engine's limits, make sure everything is in good working order. It is a 24 year old car after all.

[tkelly27]

Rowland has it right.

I'd just like to add if you plan on going to the blow through style, it will be worth your time to go to the junkyard and pick up a whole '88-'89 head, intake, exhuast manifold, fuel rail, and all the other little dodads.

Unfortunately the best way to remove the turbo is to remove the head. Even with 36k, when your stock head gasket goes, you'll think about all the hours you spent on your back trying to reach all the turbo fastners and what a pain it was to get it past everything. I spent two weeks figuring out how to remove the turbo without the head (I can do it in a few hours now) then 200 miles later the HG blew!

When you turn up the boost, parts start to break. Consider that when you're modifying your DD : P

[85gts321]

yea i would like to keep as a daily. Would it be in my favor to intercool the system even with a factory setup? I know the boost will drop cause of the extra plumbing but will the cooler temps help? I dont know much about turbos but a buddy of mine has a brand new bored ct26 intake side off of a toyota mr2 turbo. Will that bolt to the exhaust side of the factory turbo?

I just want (for now) for it to be reliable and be somewhat entertaining to drive (hense why i didnt buy a civic as a daily). I just need to find a reliable way to aid the rediculous amount of turbo lag. haha

[2.5TURBO]

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkelly27 Unfortunately the best way to remove the turbo is to remove the head. Even with 36k, when your stock head gasket goes, you'll think about all the hours you spent on your back trying to reach all the turbo fastners and what a pain it was to get it past everything. I spent two weeks figuring out how to remove the turbo without the head (I can do it in a few hours now) then 200 miles later the HG blew!

i have a t1 car and a t2 car and both were easy to get the turbos out w/ the head on???? the t1 was my first experience doing this and it took 6 hours to take apart and fully put back together! my brass coolant adapter broke on my t2 car(swapped to t1 turbo cuz the t2 blew) and i has to pull the turbo out and it only took 2-3 hours w/ t2 intake. maybe i work on these cars wwwwwaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyy too much and it is like changing oil...you know what needs to be done and you just do it!
just my experience

[EvilcowRoland]

It isn't that the turbo is hard to get out. I mean, it's annoying but not impossible. Usually the issue is the rusted and frozen bolts that like to ring off (assuming you can get the torque on them). If you rebuild your engine/head/turbo whatever, do yourself a favor and use stainless steel hardware with washers. Been down that road a time or 2.

As for intercooling the GTS, I wouldn't unless you switch to the later style intake (which would involve a little bit or work, but not really hard). A few people have put an intercooler on log intake setups but it ends up being more trouble than it's worth. You're still being limited by the intake. And it's a lot of work for smalls gains. It'd be worth your time to do the proper conversion. DDG- Conversion page from 85-87 Turbo I to Turbo II

I don't know anything about the MR2 turbo, but I doubt it will work. Your turbo is a T03 made by Garrett. You might be able to get other Garrett turbo compressor sides to fit (for example, 80's Saabs used the same turbo but without coolant passages). The problem is our exhaust manifolds. The turbo sits far enough behind the engine that they needed to turn the neck of the compressor housing to allow the hoses to clear the head. If you get an exhaust manifold that moves the turbo towards the driver's side then you could run some different combinations.

The T1 is a little laggy, but it shouldn't be that bad. Check your cam and ignition timing.