Trying turbo HEP on non turbo car.

[BobD]

Hi All,
I thought I read somewhere that you can use a pick-up coil from a turbo car on an efi car. Is this true. My new 94 Sundance won't start and I'd like to try it if it's possible. I have lots of turbo HEP's laying around. I'm not getting any codes though. Also, the timing belt is correct. (It was off one cog, but I changed that. Still no start.) As it is, I only heard the car kick once. This was before I corrected the timing. Just to be sure someone else didn't put the belt on wrong, I did try turning the cam 180 degrees. No difference.
Any Ideas?

[lotashelbys]

If its not showing any codes its got to be mechanical. Do you got fuel pressure? The fuel pump is the first place I would start. Good luck buddy....

[BobD]

It's getting fuel. That's for sure. I had the air cleaner cover off and it was puffing fuel up while I was cranking the engine. That's originally why I checked to see if it was out 180 degrees. It just didn't look right. But it did the same thing with the timing off. Also, I don't know too much about these EFI cars. In fact last time I tried to figure out my Mom's Sundance, I GAVE UP! LOL. Not like me to do that. She brought it somewhere and got it running. Now that I think of it, I believe that was a HEP "without" a code. Otherwise, I would have changed it in a heartbeat.

[EvilcowRoland]

I don't think the injectors will fire if the HEP isn't giving a reference signal for the turbo cars. Not sure about the TBI system. I've always been told the HEPs are independent of application. You can't swap them between turbo and non-turbo. But I've never tried it. It won't hurt it to throw the turbo HEP in and try it. Just plug in the black wire only and see. But I don't think that'll be the problem. Is it turning over (starter engaging and rotating engine)?

[BobD]

I already got it confirmed that you can do it. As it is, as I was digging in to the car deeper, I found black spark plugs and 2 rockers popped off the cam. That's nice to see. At least I'm making headway. I'll know in just a little while if that's all my problems. I bought the car figuring the engine may be junk so this is a bit better.

[charger R/T]

compare the 2. The turbo uses 2 pickups and the tbi uses 1 If the half the tbi uses looks the same pop it in and plug it up and see what happens. Also look on mini mopars site under code 11. I think it says something like computer has NEVER seen hep signal. So basicly if the engine has ever started it will never set that code. Try disconnecting the battery and cranking it over and see if an 11 pops up.
Tim
heres a link
http://minimopar.knizefamily.net/fault/code11.html

[BobD]

Well, The car runs. I do have the turbo HEP in it also. I'm going to switch that out. I'm sure all the problems were the timing being off one cog and the followers being off the cam. Now to put the car back together and take it for a ride.

[phantomrt]

Cool. The only question now is how did the followers manage to fall off? I imagine something like a bolt got stuck between the valve and its seat, holding the valve open and then the followers can just fall off

I didn't make it to the meeting cuz... well, a little incident with a hood coming open at highway speeds. I spent much of the afternoon picking glass out of my teeth and ears, etc. Probably $1k of damage done.

[BobD]

Hi Paul. That's too bad about the hood. Which vehicle? The truck?
As for the followers, I've seen wore cam and followers cause this problem twice on two different cars my sister owned. But those were sliders so that's obvious why they'd come off. My Dad had one come off of his 2.5 with a roller cam. That was because my cousin got the van running after a - 25 degree cold spell that stranded the vehicle for a few days. My Dad called me up after he got his van back and said it was running rough. Then he said my cousin got it running. He said my cousin is kind of a crazy kid. When he said that, the first thing I thought was that when the van got running, he probably over rev'd the thing and threw a rocker. I brought it home and I was right. That was 8+ years ago and it's never had a problem since. I just pryed the valve and popped it back in place.
Well, the car is together so after I eat, I'm going for a ride! I wonder if Jim got this car from a fire sale? It smells like a campfire inside.

[BobD]

I'm also assuming the followers came off and got jambed for a second causing the belt to jump.

[phantomrt]

I suppose an accidental (or intentional) excessive downshift could make the engine spin 8k RPM, the valves float, and basically there is nothing to hold the follower in place. If it runs good, I'll bet that is what happened.

Yea, it was the truck.

[BobD]

Quote:

excessive downshift

Trouble is, It's an auto. I think over revving it in nuetral will do that. My sister tended to do that and she lost the followers twice. Granted, they were wore cams, but I've never thrown one and I've had a wore cam or two.
Would insurance cover anything on the truck? I'd guess not. I lost a hood once. Luckily, it flew up so fast, it missed the car. I should have told my old room mate not to drive my 1970 Buick GS over 30 with only a bungy cord holding the hood down.

[phantomrt]

It should have a 6000 RPM rev limiter, so I would think that even if it was an auto trans... what is to keep a person from jamming it into 1st gear at freeway speeds? It is much easier to accidentally do this with an auto than a manual trans. Unless these transmissions are have mechanicals smart enough to prevent this. I have never tried. Heh. Sounds like something for Myth busters.

I'll have to call the insurance company and ask if this is a covered item. I'd consider this a type of mechanical failure and not an act of nature or whatnot. I think that if I find the correct color hood, I can fix it for less than the deductable. The parts search begins.