1987 GLHS#0896 Project log - Page 9 - Turbo Dodge Forums : Turbo Dodge Forum for Turbo Mopars, Shelbys, Dodge Daytona, Dodge SRT-4, Chrysler PT Cruiser, Omni and more!
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post #121 of 465 Old 04-12-2014, 01:15 PM Thread Starter
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

Quote:
Originally Posted by RGL10 View Post
That's a VERY organized shop you have there Donnie! I waste so much time trying to find stuff, I need to follow your example as it would cut my build time in half for sure.

How is the inside of the scroll area in your turbine housing? My .63 Garrett was very rough and had a casting seam ridge right up the middle. I've been smoothing it down as I have time with a few homemade tools.

[IMG][/IMG]
- My work area MUST be organized to the very smallest details usually.
The limited amount of space I have requires it.
thanks for the compliment but, in the pics, I did just straighten it up after the winter.

- My experience with the Holset turbos is limited to this very one but,
I surely understand and have experience with the Garrett casting flaws that somehow made it past QC.
IMHO, if there's an owner of ANY Garrett turbo, remove it and free up the horsepower it's currently wasting.
(Just my opinion)
Not that Garrett makes a "Bad" turbo; I happen to be a big fan of theirs.
But after removing the GLHS unit and, also seeing 2 separate turbos I was thinking about using for the build,
my mind switched off like a blown FUSE on Garrett and,
I immediately bought a Turbonetics unit.
Then the HE351CW idea began to shine and, I sold the Turbonetics turbo and,
bought the Holset.
During disassembly for rebuild, I checked it over closer than I had ever inspected any turbo before.
This was partially due to the incredible workmanship employed.
It appears that Holset really does their due diligence inspecting before shipping them out.
The casting flaws are indeed there but, very-very minor and, anyone who'd simply be replacing their factory Cummins turbo,
wouldn't need be concerned with them at all.
In my case, I'll be making both housings as close to perfection as I possibly can.

Thanks again Randy; you continue to inspire me and my efforts with this build.

GLHS#0896
Under Construction

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post #122 of 465 Old 04-16-2014, 01:46 PM
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

Some very nice progress in the works here :)

Glad you were able to find a Good one, that Holset is DaBomb! As long as you can get the rest of your ducks in a row, get ready to Hang on for dear LIFE!
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post #123 of 465 Old 04-16-2014, 06:14 PM Thread Starter
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

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Originally Posted by Shadow View Post
Some very nice progress in the works here :)

Glad you were able to find a Good one, that Holset is DaBomb! As long as you can get the rest of your ducks in a row, get ready to Hang on for dear LIFE!
Thanks Shadow.
Yeah, I've done my fair share of research on the 351.
My feeling is that it'll run 30lbs ALL DAY if need be,
and not even break a sweat.
I joined several diesel forums and have had talks with many of their members.
The word is that of the 351's, the HE351CW is the best one to get.
And, that comes from the diesel guys who are running theirs at 40+ lbs. on the regular!

So "Hanging on" I will be doing a lot of.
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post #124 of 465 Old 04-16-2014, 10:05 PM
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

Quote:
Originally Posted by signsoflife22 View Post
Thanks Shadow.
Yeah, I've done my fair share of research on the 351.
My feeling is that it'll run 30lbs ALL DAY if need be,
and not even break a sweat.
I joined several diesel forums and have had talks with many of their members.
The word is that of the 351's, the HE351CW is the best one to get.
And, that comes from the diesel guys who are running theirs at 40+ lbs. on the regular!

So "Hanging on" I will be doing a lot of.
were you planning on getting it running this year? id really like to see what kind of monster you come up with
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post #125 of 465 Old 04-17-2014, 06:37 AM Thread Starter
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

Quote:
Originally Posted by acannell View Post
were you planning on getting it running this year? id really like to see what kind of monster you come up with
Originally I had set a date of September 2014.
But, then some realities began to confront me;
1. There are some minor obstacles with PenDot(Pennsylvania Department of Transportation); with my licence, not the car.

2. The amount of money necessary to properly assemble a vehicle to meet my goals, and lofty standards.

3. WINTER!!!

So, the last time I set a tentative date it was March of 2015. So, an additional 6 months.

There has been activity here that I have yet to include in this log.
But, I will indeed share it all in the best detail I can.

The ideas for this "monster" are based on the old Dodge Intrepid commercials,
"Form Follows Function".
The primary focus is on the mechanical side and, not that the car won't be "pretty",
but that's not a major concern.
I had thought about painting it Flat Black at one point and,
painting a gloss black AAR Cuda stripe down the side.

Stay tuned.

GLHS#0896
Under Construction

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post #126 of 465 Old 04-20-2014, 07:24 PM Thread Starter
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

20 April 2014(Easter Sunday; no rest for the boosted)lol

So, got back to the turbine in the sandblaster and continued the cleaning work.
This would be the 2nd pass of a projected three.
(3 passes due to the 40gal compressor I use that runs out sooner than I'd like)

So, here's the progress thus far:






All important 9cm turbine casting number:


All important HOLSET casting:


Next are some interesting pictures specifically for RGL10.
These are my best shot at showing the fantastic casting work done by HOLSET.
This is into the Turbine.
Sure, some slight defects, but ever look into the factory Garrett?


This is where I feel it gets interesting.
And, I sure hope you can see what I saw when I shined the light into the housing.
The inner walls of the Turbine are very smooth.




Then, I got that command valve off of the Compressor housing without the recommended spanner wrench.
(clamped the valve in the vice and turned the entire housing)




Thanks for looking and, stay tuned; more to come soon...


GLHS#0896
Under Construction

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post #127 of 465 Old 04-21-2014, 12:51 PM
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

Looks great dude!
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post #128 of 465 Old 04-21-2014, 10:49 PM
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

That turbine housing looks nice compared to the Garrett. Mine had 1/8 inch high casting bumps in about 5 places inside the turbine housing plus numerous pits and a very large seam right through the middle. Holset definitely has their act together. Thanks for the pictures!
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post #129 of 465 Old 04-22-2014, 06:40 AM Thread Starter
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

Quote:
Originally Posted by RGL10 View Post
That turbine housing looks nice compared to the Garrett. Mine had 1/8 inch high casting bumps in about 5 places inside the turbine housing plus numerous pits and a very large seam right through the middle. Holset definitely has their act together. Thanks for the pictures!
The housing is great in that, the further into it you go, the smoother it gets.
Inside the housing air channel, it's VERY smooth.

I have since done some measuring, and there are slight mods afoot.
(just wouldn't be right if it's not FULL) lol

Stay tuned.
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post #130 of 465 Old 05-01-2014, 08:28 PM Thread Starter
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

Just a bit further on the Turbine housing.
I have learned that the Holset can sometimes have "creep" characteristics,
due to the size of the wastegate port being too small;
And, also a bit too "angled" apposed to the direction of the exhaust flow.

So, after thorough investigation(made ab-SOL-utely sure I wasn't about to destroy my 9cm housing),
I have begun the process of increasing the diameter of the port.

Here's some pics:

4.97mm all the way around ^





So, I found a washer that met the measurement I figured would be good; 26.68mm(my idea was 27mm, but close enough),
and using a right angle pick tool, I marked the housing:


I understand it appears to be off center, but it's not.
The port is actually off center in the cut-out of the housing.












And so far, I'm at 25.19mm. Just a bit more to go.


I also began the process of smoothing the inside of the housing's walls.








I guess that's about it for today.
Thanks for checking in.
Have a great day!

GLHS#0896
Under Construction

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post #131 of 465 Old 05-06-2014, 06:54 PM
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

Currently I am working on a GLHS with my son. I live in Pa also. I've been following your posts. You have very aggressive goals for the car. How fast did the car go before you tore it down? Our goal is to go 13's next time out then by end of summer 12's. Like you we are shooting for the 11's but we will be waiting until winter to pull the car down since my son wants to race over the summer.
From what I can figure it shouldn't be very hard to get one of these cars in the 11's. The turbo you are working on looks like a 9 second turbo. Are you using the factory exhaust manifold with that turbo? If so . Will that turbo clear the firewall? Or are you going to have to clearance the firewall? We have a 351 turbo brand new in the box my son bought for a diesel truck that he owned but unfortunately totaled. I'll have to let him know if it will work on his Charger.
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post #132 of 465 Old 05-06-2014, 08:44 PM Thread Starter
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

Quote:
Originally Posted by hemicuda528 View Post
Currently I am working on a GLHS with my son. I live in Pa also. I've been following your posts. You have very aggressive goals for the car. How fast did the car go before you tore it down? Our goal is to go 13's next time out then by end of summer 12's. Like you we are shooting for the 11's but we will be waiting until winter to pull the car down since my son wants to race over the summer.
From what I can figure it shouldn't be very hard to get one of these cars in the 11's. The turbo you are working on looks like a 9 second turbo. Are you using the factory exhaust manifold with that turbo? If so . Will that turbo clear the firewall? Or are you going to have to clearance the firewall? We have a 351 turbo brand new in the box my son bought for a diesel truck that he owned but unfortunately totaled. I'll have to let him know if it will work on his Charger.
HeHe, the "goals" I have set for the GLHS are very , um, achievable.
I just want to set them, and then build a car that will SURELY make them.

Personally, I feel the DYNO will be showing more along the lines of 500+FWHP, but who's to say until it's there.
As for the 1/4 mi. times, the "11sec range" "goal" is a number I basically just reached out of thin air.
I bet the first time I roll down the track with it, I'll be in the 15s due to tire spin.
See, at this point, the car and I have more of a surgeon/patient relationship.
I know all about the car's anatomy, but I really have NO CLUE how it'll live day to day yet.
It'll definitely take a little time to become best friends.lol

As for the turbo selection; while investigating my options,
I came across a YouTube vid of "Worlds Fastest Turbo Dodge Shelby Charger 8v 4cyl Omni"(linked below),

and this is not necessarily a "good thing" for a guy like me.
Because having seen such performance I thought,
"Why "F" around with gradual upgrades?!!"
And the process you see outlined here began.

The exhaust I'll be using will include a personally fabbed tubular header.
This, even though I've been advised that a properly ported stock mani would suffice,
is something I personally feel is necessary.
But to answer your question; As for bolting in; No, the 351 won't "bolt-in".
And, there are several other necessary mods for it to properly perform in your system.
(Actually, it won't perform in your system as it is now)
The one your son has "in the box", does it have the 9cm turbine housing?
This is A MUST for a 2.2 application.
The exhaust pressure generated by the 2.2 won't be great enough to propel the turbine wheel efficiently in a larger area turbine.
The mounting flange on the Holset is a T3,
and the factory Dodge exhaust mani has a ChryCo flange.
This can be remedied, but it involves some stud relocating.
Just a few of the other mods you'll need to use the 351 with your car would include:
Larger T/B, Larger injectors, 255FP(or greater), Custom CAL, in addition to several others as well.

It's a project; to say the least.

The goals you have for the GLHS are definitely attainable.
Our main advantage over other cars is gross vehicle weight.
Our beloved TDs are LIGHT!(especially our "L" bodys) And that makes for speed and agility.
But, with a proper tune, your car, as it is, should run 13s without a problem.
And, the mods necessary to get to the 12s aren't that involved really.
(ie: Custom CAL, +20% injectors(might as well go +40% because you will eventually anyway),
58mm T/B(or a 52mm at least), and, a bit better ignition components than stockers)

Your biggest issue will be the a525 transaxle, for sure.
You'll most likely destroy it before you're done playing in the 13s.
There are other tansaxles to be had, but the mods are pretty involved,
as the shifters use cable linkage and, the 525 uses rods.
(although there is a rod adapter kit for the a555)

If you're interested in my opinion, replace the trans first.
I recommend the a555. it's a much heavier duty unit, but it does shift a bit harder.
There's the a568 & a523, which A LOT of members swear by.
It's truly a matter of personal choice.
Are you concerned with smooth as silk shifting?(a568 & a523)
Or just want the rigid, strong, reliable, BEAST of a transaxle?(a555)
This is not to say that the a568 or a523 are weak or anything,
I just prefer the a555 because I used one in my last GLHS, and it was some kind of un-blow-up-able trans!
I pounded and pounded it(before really knowing how to drive well),
and it lived on, day by day, taking the beatings, until the L/F axle snapped in two!

Well, I've rambled on far too long,
and surely opened myself up to some critique.
But, that's what the forum is all about;
Helping out those who may be in need based on our experience(s).

BTW: Are you in NEPA?
We should stay in touch. I may have some GLHS parts you'll need.

Thanks for checking out the thread.
Now that the weather has FINALLY broken, things may actually start happening around here.

GLHS#0896
Under Construction

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post #133 of 465 Old 05-06-2014, 09:08 PM
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

My son is only 19 and in school so he has a limited budget for know. The rods and pistons would be our weak link at this point. He blew the trans a couple of years ago and we put in a trans I found and had rebuilt. We also put in stronger axles from Forward motion and the heim joints for the shifter linkage. We live near Maple Grove Dragway. We ran the car there the last two weeks in a row. With the crappy street tires we were trying to get into the 13's. The best I was able to run before I through in the towel was a 14.40 @ 101.9 mph.
I kept improving but I figured it was a waste to beat the car trying to run those street tire when I would rather save the car for when I have some tires that will give it some traction. I may take the car back Friday night to give it a try they have a Test and Tune Scheduled. I'll keep watching your build. Good luck. If you get that turbo right it should go 9's.
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post #134 of 465 Old 05-16-2014, 01:26 PM Thread Starter
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

5-13-2014 and 5-14-2014

Hello again.
Not to keep jumping all over the place,
but I feel I should correct a change I've made with the fuel system.

Back in post #19 of this log, I said I would be using the DeatschWerks DW300 Fuel Pump because it,
"has a much better consistency of flow than ANY other I've looked at".
Well, in further investigations, I found the AEM pump to be of the same(or greater) consistency.
So, I decided to use the AEM pump(part# 50-1000, 320 liters per hour).




Also, the plans for the sending unit I had started work on in pic filled post #20,
have changed as well.
I am still going to use the increased diameter line,
but rather than going through the sending unit cover with the hard line and welding it,
I have decided to use -6AN bulkhead fittings and crush washers.



So, here's the updated version of the sending unit progress:
First I had to cut the newly bent lines away from the sending unit,
and grind the welds flat to the original surface of the cover:


Removed the additional line securing bracket from inside the sender cover:
(It's spot welded on; simply drilled into the welds, and pried it off carefully)








Re-sized the line holes to 13mm, to fit the -6AN bulkhead fittings in place:
(Did this by tracing the inside diameter of one of the crush washers,
and drilling several 1/16" holes until the edge was close.
Then used a "stepper bit" to make them perfectly circular)

(Note: Both holes will be identical. Feed line will be 3/8" and return will be 5/16".
Both of which can safely mate to -6AN fittings)



Checked the fitment once the first hole was done(for sure clearance):




Did the exact same procedure for the other fitting:




And, WA-LA!
(Sender cover completed)


I then welded one of the lines I had cut away, back onto the cover to secure the fuel pump, level float and soldered in the wiring.
I also made the necessary adjustments/modifications to the pump support housing:


Additional little notches in the clip to clear the different pump and pick-up screen:










Next, using the blue, Hard line to -6AN fitting adapters,
I began the process of bending and installing the lines for the sender:
These fittings are a really great idea. Simply flare the line and install the fitting.
the AN adapter not only thread to the bulkhead fitting, but also secures the hard line with the insert.
Here are the parts:






I haven't completely finished it yet, because I don't have the submersible rubber hose I'll need to connect to the pump.
But once I get it(hopefully in the next day or two),
I'll update the post.

Also, following the linked thread below, I reconditioned my sending unit's contacts.

https://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/...ding-unit.html

(I have detailed, step by step instructions with pics for this,
but I don't feel it's necessary to post them here;
As it's covered very well in the linked thread)


So now, here's what I have so far:


Thanks for looking.
Best wishes to all.

GLHS#0896
Under Construction

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post #135 of 465 Old 05-16-2014, 01:31 PM
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Re: 1987 GLHS#0896 Project log

Lookin good Donnie....
One thing I have discovered when replacing/modifying the pump hanger is that the float level should be measured/recorded before the mods are done. So that when you have it back together you can then check to see if the float is at the exact same height upon completion. Had I done this the first time or two, I would have saved having to remove the pump a few times to make adjustments. BTW...if your float and wiper/coil setup is not in great shape, an 88 Omni TBI hanger that comes w/a cheap-o pump on it is a direct replacement.
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