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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Dear diary,

I bought a garaged 1985 New Yorker Turbo, Super Nintendo yellow with all the goodies. I had it towed to my house. It starts with starter fluid sprayed in and sounds good! The fuel pump is silent. (I even pulled the hose off of the pump, banged on it, flicked the relay repeatedly...no flow. I already had a new pump for it, that I originally bought for another car.)

The body and interior are in fantastic condition! The headliner is going to have to be replaced / spray-tacked back up. There's a teeeeny bit of surface rust under the trunk and a small chip in one brake light lens.

I have every intention of driving this car to and from work every day. (-: There's a lot I could do, but I don't want to lose the original car. I'm thinking of keeping the non-cooled 2.2 turbo, since performance mods are a bit of trouble on these anyway, but I'm open to suggestions. The AM/FM cassette and voice assist will definitely stay, though I'm definitely looking at replacing the speakers. Adding any sort of high quality input like a 3.5mm connector is probably out of the question unless I solder something straight into the radio. Keeping the original rims, for sure.

The fuel pump AND sending unit appear to be bad. It reads as an empty tank, and the fuel pump makes no sound at all. Unfortunately, the tank is over-filled. The last owner filled the tank right before it died, then over-filled it...then I bought it and thought it was out of gas and added even more until it came splashing back out. So now, the tank is full of 15 year old gas. I've been siphoning gas out through the filler tube for a while, and I'll try lowering the tank enough tomorrow to get the rest of the gas out through the top.
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
I wonder what could be wrong...

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Out of curiosity, I put it on the bench and tried beating it while giving it 12v. It clicks, but that's it.

I've got the new pump in, replaced most of the rubber fuel lines and hose clamps, and fired it up! The wheels drag a LOT. It seems to be leaking coolant (I think?) and there's a vacuum leak somewhere around the throttle body. It gets a code 15 (vehicle speed sensor, no signal detected), though the digital speedometer works. The stereo sounds surprisingly good, by the way. I honestly think it would pass Virginia inspection right now, except for one small thing.

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Drat, I have no idea how to fix that. I'll just see if I can make something work for now. Also it might need a new track bar. It's bent, though I might be able to simply straighten it. One of the tires is pretty unevenly worn, so I think the track bar is bent out of alignment. So far, it's a great start! The engine sounds good. The A/C kicks on. Exhaust is clean, as is the oil. The turbo plays a note, so I might have to swap that before too long. It's leaking oil around the valve cover, no surprise.

I'm a bit surprised there's no tach, no boost gauge, nothing on it that would hint at being a Turbo. I appreciate the talking computer. It was very useful on my 85 Laser XE. I thought there was a test button that would make it cycle through its messages, but I can't remember how.
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
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Hmm, this AIS seems to be hard to find. Mine started and idled just fine. Then I tried the A/C out one time, and the idle started going up and up and up. I pulled this guy out, and it was pretty well stuck from carbon and something that rusted up around the TB. It needed a deep cleaning! I pulled it apart, got the planetary gears mixed up, cleaned it, put it back together twelve times, tested it, and it opens and shuts just fine. Back on the car, it won't start unless I give it gas. The motor moves, but it won't idle by itself. I turn the motor by hand, and the idle goes all the way up. NAJ has a tutorial on calibrating the AIS. I assumed it was related to the newer throttle body, but perhaps it's the same procedure. I'll give it a shot! (-:
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
AIS motor: Part 2

The reset procedure written up by NAJ makes perfect sense. It seems that what is happening during the reset is the AIS motor attempts to close when there's a large vacuum leak. Then you turn the car off, plug the AIS in, dance the key, and your AIS is zero'd. However, what seems to be happening to me is a little weird. Every time I do the procedure (three times so far), the next time I start it after reset it's at about 1,500 rpm. The second time it's at about 1,200. The third time it's at about 500 and shaking. Then it won't start unless I give it gas. Reset, rinse, repeat. The good news is that it seems the motor works just fine and the LM is probably doing its job the best it can. Maybe there's a vacuum leak.

I did notice that the seal is leaking, though that has me a bit puzzled, too. It doesn't seem to seal at all around the O-ring, which doesn't look to be too bad. However, there is a vacuum leak around the back that is so fast it's like there's no O-ring at all. I wrapped the back of the plastic housing with vinyl tape until I had a snug fit. It doesn't seem to be leaking there anymore, but now it seems to be leaking around the tabs that the hose clamp goes around. If it's leaking there, how on earth is it supposed to seal?? Unfortunately I don't have another of this type to compare.

I'm strongly tempted to remove the AIS altogether and just adjust the idle screw until I get a workable compromise. (My second car was a 1971 Buick Electra with a 455 and a 4-bbl Quadrajet. I'm not opposed to a warm-up procedure.)

As a last resort, I could do something much more primitive. Somewhere I have an old choke valve from....I don't even remember what car! :-D It's about 3/4" diameter, and it bolts onto the thermostat housing with two vacuum lines. Inside is just a bimetallic strip. When the engine's cold, it closes (chokes), and when the engine's hot, it vents. I don't see why I couldn't just flip the metallic strip over and make it do the opposite. . .

Turbo whine: Part 2

The turbo whine is gone, completely gone. It has a delightful spin-up whisssstle and boosts perfectly well. It's slow, compared to the Daytona, but it feels about like the 85 Laser I had.

One more problem:

The vapor can is dumping gasoline. Wooh! The tank was way over-filled, as mentioned before. But man, how much could be in there?? Actually, it seems to be mostly water with a little bit of gasoline. So many questions...
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Oh, and code 15 is gone, now code 54 is there, but I think both are unimportant.
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I'm hitting a slight wall with the idle control. I tried the reset procedure several more times, and I also tried disassembling and reassembling the AIS motor again. It still seems to act like it has some logic. Sometimes it stays idling high and just keeps resetting higher and higher every time I start the car. Other times it drops down to no air and stays there until I do the reset procedure again. siiigh My next attempt was to disable the AIS and just adjust the idle set screw (that the throttle lever stops on)...but it shattered! (-: I'm just gonna have to remove the TB and replace that screw with, uhhh, something.

The hood spring wasn't so bad. I took a throttle return spring, $2.50 from the parts shop, and bent a section of it up. It works pretty well! The car ought to pass Virginia inspection now (though they might say it needs tires first). I'm probably going to make or buy a clip to go over the end to keep the spring from springing off.

276168
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I re-did the IAC motor from scratch using this thread: Old style AIS question, 87 and older T1 It turns out I had two cogs reversed. It spun smoothly on the bench before, and it spins smoothly now, but unfortunately the idle still goes wherever it wants. If anyone knows a retrofit, workaround, etc., that maintains driveability, I'm open to suggestions.

On to other things for now. The driver's window stopped going up. It's not bad to take the door panel off. Two screws for the mirror control, two for the window control, one for the door panel into metal, then a door prybar to pop the springs out. It's a hard-board panel, which usually means it disintegrates when it's taken off, but this car was kept nice and dry all its life. Two electrical connectors for the mirror control, one for the windows, and one for the illumination...no problem. Tilt the door up about 45 degrees, then lower it down a bit and raise the side furthest from the hinges, and slide it out a little and it all comes out.

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I peeled the plastic and the paper behind it as gently as possible. (This door has a dynamat type material applied in various places around the door! Is that normal for an 85 New Yorker? That's certainly part of why this old girl rides so quiet, and the stereo sounds so clear for its limited hardware.) Three bolts hold the window motor on, and they're easy to remove, as is the motor itself. The electrical connector is hard to see but easy to manipulate and disconnect/reconnect. The wire harness clips all stripped, but I didn't see it necessary to reattach them.

I bought Dorman 747-411 from the local CarQuest distribution center for under $20. Great deal! It has just one review, which is to say that the purchaser installed it, it broke shortly thereafter, and they bought another. Well....I bought one, it broke immediately, and I re-rebuilt it with parts from the old one.

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This is what it looked like when I first took it apart. There are supposed to be three cylinders in the lobes. I have NO IDEA what the point is. I was tempted to just fill the thing with JB Weld and put it back together. All I can think is that it's some sort of damper, but the parts have to cram together so hard it doesn't seem effective.

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Boy is this motor strong! That's a Korad power supply next to it. I manually set 1v with 1a max current, and I couldn't stop the motor. I installed the motor back on the car, and it worked! Twice! The teeth on the Dorman cog broke apart. I reinstalled the original cog from the motor, and it seems to work just fine now.

All in all, I guess the only thing I needed from the Dorman kit was the set of plastic cylinders that I probably could have made myself! :-D I'll just do that next time.

Anyway, tires go on the car tomorrow, and now that the driver's window goes down and up, it should pass inspection.....except that my son wanted to see me try the windshield washer, since the talking voice complained about the washer fluid. The wipers are good, and I checked the motor and arms a couple times already, but today it decided to pop one of the transfer arms off. u_u Yes, I have the bushings...Yes, I'll fix it in the morning.

The rolling drag seems to be the front brake calipers holding on too tight. I drove a mile and it loosened up a little, but I think the safest thing would be to compress them. Every time I've let a car with very old dragging brakes "wear in" from driving, they end up constantly getting tighter until they don't move. I got as good of a look as I could into the steering, suspension, exhaust, underside, etc., and there don't seem to be any problems there at all.

Running the engine and taking the oil cap off nets zero smoke. (-: I think there are very small leaks in the engine bay side of the heater core hoses, and a couple easily replaced pieces of coolant pipe are rusted to the point that I'm surprised they hold any pressure. Easy stuff.
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
My temporary throttle fix. :-D

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I couldn't get the screw out, and I don't want to drill or anything right now. The IAC motor still has a mind of its own, so a hose clamp on the throttle lever gave it just a smidge of throttle.

The windshield wiper linkages were all pulverized, and I'm pretty sure there is either supposed to be a bushing, grommet, or something between the arms and the actuators. It's metal on metal with nothing holding anything on. I seem to remember a common size plumbing grommet being perfect for these linkages. I have plenty of the linkage caps, though.

The wheel drag is completely gone. I compressed the calipers in a few times to get them to loosen up, and now they work fine. Now that it rolls freely, I'm wondering why the car has absolutely NO pickup at low throttle. The plugs and wires were old and barely working, so I changed those. It's a new fuel pump, filter, lines, and gas tank contents. I haven't flushed the injectors out yet. The turbo kicks in and sounds like I'm used to. I haven't checked timings yet, but again it doesn't "feel" like a timing problem. It doesn't seem to misfire, bog, jerk, etc. It doesn't get loud at all. It's not throwing any codes. It simply feels like the the throttle isn't being opened. 0 to 25 takes a good 8 seconds. 25 to 50 takes about 2 to 3 seconds. Even N/A should be quicker. I'll get the injectors off and make sure they have good spray. The car sat for almost 15 years, and the old ethanol really ate the rubber lines. Who knows what's in the injectors!
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
OH! And the previous owner of the car just turned 99 today! He's a WWII hero, radio genius, and an all around awesome guy. He has a 100% original Mercury Cougar Eliminator. :love: When I say 100%, I mean that it has the original hose clamps and every piece of factory interior packaging.

Another OH! I already have the personalized plate to go on this very aged-plastic looking mid-1980's American car. (I don't have a photo of the tag handy, so here's the DMV website mockup):

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Advance carries the "correct" bushing for the wiper actuators and relay bar. Sold in pairs for $16. I need three...sorry Advance, but I think I'm gonna make these myself.
 

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Concerning your low speed poor performance, are you sure it is dropping down into first gear from a stop? I have the same car and mine accelerates fine. Not as stout as a stock GLH-T, but acceptable. Sounds like your starting off in second gear not first. It should be shifting out of first gear around 13-15 MPH and into drive around 25-30 MPH under normal (light) throttle loads. Perhaps the governor in the tranny is not working properly?
Cool about the original owner. Sounds like a guy I'd love to talk to. Always had a soft spot for the Mercury cars esp. the performance models like the Eliminators, GTE's, XR7-G, and Comets too. Way back in the day a short order cook at a Mr. Steak in my hometown drove a GTE. Black with silver trim. Unfortunately he drove it year around through the snow etc. Tried a couple times to pry that car away from him, but to no avail. I always knew how special that car was, but apparently the owner did not. He was just using it for transportation, and this was back during gas crises around 1975.
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
That's exactly what it feels like! I would never have thought of that. I will try to get it on the highway and feel how it shifts. I gotta get new tires on the car today anyway. Then I can put the wire spoke caps back on the wheels, good for an extra 25HP. ;-)

He's always got stories to tell. I'd love to interview him for YouTube some time, but he's much too humble.
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I took it for another test drive on 45 MPH roads. (I got stopped by a car-full of people asking about the car, haha!) It does shift through all three speeds, and it actually shifts very quickly. However, something I must not have noticed originally is that there is about a 5 or 6 second boost lag. The turbo whines delightfully as soon as I take off, but it takes about 5 or 6 seconds before it has that loud boosty hum sound in the engine. Whether that's because the turbo is spooling up slowly or if the lack of power means lack of exhaust means turbo lag, I'm not sure. The initial takeoff feels like my old 85 N/A 2.2l Caravan felt like. Around 35 MPH, it feels like a late 90's Altima 4-cylinder. The vacuum lines are all original (and not self-destructed!) and I don't detect any leaks. The wastegate arm moves smoothly and returns to the closed position promptly.
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Code 15 and 54 are back. I read a few of the code 54 related threads, and fuel pump and HEI pickup are the two most commonly referenced causes. The pump is a new Mopar pump. It claimed to be compatible, though a different Mopar part number was indicated. I kind of doubt that's it, since the problem only happens at low speed, and the motor is strong at high RPM under boost. The HEI wire, on the other hand, was crushed under the distributor. I figured that would cause the car to refuse to start, but....it's easy to swap and compare.

Code 15? No signal from vehicle speed sensor? Uhm, the digital dash shows the right speed, and the odometer counts up correctly. Even the fuel estimates seem about right on the computer. shrugs Not sure there...but I don't think it matters.
 

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Since your tranny is starting out in first gear, I'd be checking cam timing as next likely suspect for very poor low speed performance. Retarded cam timing one or two teeth could cause symptoms you describe. Low power at low RPM, then have normal power at higher RPM. While your at it also check ignition timing too.
Like I said, I have the exact same car. Friends that drive the car comment on how much power it has.
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
I forgot about that. That's a very good point. The timing belt is also at least 15 years old, and I have several brand new ones. (2.2 and 2.5 are identical, yah?) It was strictly dealer maintained by the previous owner, but that doesn't mean the belt stayed put. Nevertheless, I'll check it by pulling the distributor out and checking TDC at the cam before monkeying with the belt.

I did clean the pickup module and connectors and blew some rust fragments out from the rotors, and after clearing the codes and driving for a while, I haven't gotten any codes. (Maybe I didn't drive enough, though.) I remember my 85 Laser having a startling amount of power at about 2,500 RPM. It's definitely supposed to be running stronger than it is.
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Since your tranny is starting out in first gear, I'd be checking cam timing as next likely suspect for very poor low speed performance. Retarded cam timing one or two teeth could cause symptoms you describe. Low power at low RPM, then have normal power at higher RPM. While your at it also check ignition timing too.
Like I said, I have the exact same car. Friends that drive the car comment on how much power it has.
Good call! Flywheel is at 0 degrees. Here is the camshaft:

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And here is the distributor:

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The camera is parallel with the block. The misalignment of the interrupter is pretty clear.

Of course, it's not guaranteed that this is the cause of the low power, but it is definitely wrong. (-: I expected very different behavior, considering the cam timing is right. On the other hand, this is probably why I'm getting code 54, which might be putting it in limp-home mode. Piece of cake.
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
4 L-bodies, you were right. It's now MUCH stronger at takeoff. (= It's not a thrill, but it's acceptable, which is a major step in the right direction. That's the good news, and it's very good news. Unfortunately, I did it half-ass, and I'm not happy with myself for that. I simply re-aligned the existing belt. I forgot that this generation has a single 13mm crank bolt. I should have started by loosening it, so that I could remove the pulley afterwords. To be honest, the old belt looked pretty good. I went ahead and changed the old rotten motor mount, though, and I've got the other mount to change next time I'm under the car. Seeing all the rust, I know it's not going to be long before I do unnecessary disassembly and reassembly just to make it pretty anyway.

The bad news is...code 54 is still there. (Code 15 is still there, but I don't think I care.) The IAC now always raises the engine to an incredible 5000 RPM! Adjusting ignition timing is a little more tricky. I don't have a working throttle plate stop screw, and the IAC motor jacks it way up, so it's a real PITA to try to get the idle to the right speed while setting timing. I reset the IAC again and left it unplugged. I made a guess on timing to start with, and it does knock at boost.

The IAC is really ticking me off. XD I don't have another of the same motor to drop in its place, either.

There's also a really loud whine that sounds like it's coming from the alternator. siiigh At first I thought I over-tightened the belt, but that doesn't seem to be the case.

And more bad news. The rear brakes smoke and crackle after I stop. I don't know if it's leftover dust or what... Gah, this is what I get for buying a car that sat for so long.

Also the Power Limited light now comes on and stays on all the time, and Mr. Majel Barrett now says "All monitored systems are functioning normally" every time I start the car, even if the gauges are waaay off. facepalm
 

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Well your making progress. Yay! I once bought a 50K mile GLHT and it took me 3 months to fix all the gremlins. Sat for 15-16 years. Wouldn't start, wouldn't stop, and it wouldn't shift. My thought was how bad can a 50k mile GLHT be? Had some buyer's remorse, but it just took some time to sort out.
Rear wheel cylinders are probably frozen and non functional. They will still bleed okay, but cylinders won't actuate. Either that or parking brake cable(s) are frozen. I've had to replace both on just about every drum brake TD I own.
As far as the TB throttle stop. It should just be a 8mm nut to loosen on back side of TB, then a small flat blade screwdriver to adjust idle speed. This of course is a temporary fix until you get the AIS motor issue fixed.
If you don't have a timing light, adjust for highest HG vacuum reading, then retard a bit until vacuum just starts to drop. that should get you close. Should have around 18-20 HG at idle.
Don't get discouraged. I was there too when I bought my NY'er about 10 years ago. Been very reliable ever since. Just need to get the bugs worked out.
 

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91 Daytona Shelby 5Spd 2.5 T1, 85 New Yorker 2.2 T1, 89 LeBaron Convertible 2.5 T1, Many spare parts
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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Unfortunately the idle screw broke to bits when I tried to adjust it. That's why I used a hose clamp on the throttle lever (pic above) to open it a touch. It's actually a plastic cap on mine instead of a nut. I'm wondering if I could get away with partially replacing the throttle body with one from a newer one-piece style.

How many TD's have you had? I think I've had about 10, and I still have three. (Well, I could probably build a 4th with all the parts I've kept.) I've also had a handful of 2.2 N/A vehicles. Also a 1.8 and 2.6 Mitsu...but we don't talk about those. ;-p I'm not getting discouraged, but I've been out of the game for a while. I went the Nissan VQ35 path for a while, and they're great performers, but I realized I only ever smiled with these pocket rockets, and that still proves true today. One thing that surprised me is the suddenly lopsided parts availability. I have a 1991 Daytona that I parked when I couldn't find a replacement turbo for less than a couple grand. I just bought an already rebuild TE04H for $50 with a warranty. Parts for the later range of cars seem easy to find. The earlier 2.2's seem to be unicorns! I remember it being the other way around just a few years ago.
 
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