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Discussion Starter #162
I took a quick measurement on my car and its about 9 inches from the manifold mounting surface to the firewall. It would take a mighty big hammer to make that turbo fit in my engine compartment lol.
SON-OF_A!!!!! That's a tight area.
Man I sure hope the 2dr has a bit more "room to move" in there.
9 inches! YOW; that blew my mind just now.
I'm now even dumber, and even MORE FULLsignsoflife

couldn't resist mocking it up ...

lol
THAT would live front N center on my coffie table until it was ready for the car

!!
Damn Doc, if Randy's measurements match the 2dr's,
it may end up on my coffee table for good.:confused:

I gotta go lay down for a while. lol :barf:
 

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I took a quick measurement on my car and its about 9 inches from the manifold mounting surface to the firewall. It would take a mighty big hammer to make that turbo fit in my engine compartment lol.
Could you please tell me where and how you measured from exactly? I've been trying to get an accurate measurement for the L-body "behind engine" zone for my custom intake.

SOL22: I may be able to help you with determining clearance somehow before you actually install it, if that would be useful. If RGL10 tells me the distance from the head gasket surface to the firewall, and you tell me some measurements of your turbo, I can draw it up in my SW model and post up the results here.

RGL10: Heres my side view model of the engine bay in a G body..could you point out what distance you measured? The vertical dotted line is the firewall. As you can see the firewall and the head gasket surface are not parallel so it makes a difference where along the surfaces you made the measurement and also the angle of the measurement line relative to both.

 

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My measurement is a little higher up than your arrows. I did my best to measure at the top of the intake gasket and hold it level to the firewall. This was on the transmission end of the head. I have a lot of stuff in the way but that should be within a quarter of an inch or so.
 

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Just took a measurement on the Charger and I get about 9 3/4- 10" from the firewall straight across to the edge of the head where you have your tape in your pic.

Remember now, that will be the tightest area because the motor is mounted on a slight angle. Having said that, I don't think your going to find an extra 4"s, prob more like 1-2" at best. :eek:
 

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My measurement is a little higher up than your arrows. I did my best to measure at the top of the intake gasket and hold it level to the firewall. This was on the transmission end of the head. I have a lot of stuff in the way but that should be within a quarter of an inch or so.
Thank you, I think I can work with that. My model of the intake gasket is only accurate for thickness and hole locations, it doesnt have the outer shape correct. So I'll go to my engine bay and measure where the top of my gasket is relative to a bolt hole or something and that should make it correctly relative.

So 9" +/- 0.25" is your measurement?

And is that to the brake line shield or literally to the firewall?

SOL22: I dont have your custom exhaust header, but I do have stock exhaust manifolds and I can model the location of the flange the turbo mounts to.

If you can give me basic dimensions for the parts of the turbo you think would hit the firewall, I can "mount it" in the model to the stock exhaust manifold, and see where it stands as far as ballpark fitment.

And you can tell me how the flange location of your tubular header is different from the stock manifold (if it is) and I can adjust for that.

You never know with fitment, unless its really obvious, who knows it might squeeze in there. Or at least we could see how much hammering you are going to have to do!
 

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Just took a measurement on the Charger and I get about 9 3/4- 10" from the firewall straight across to the edge of the head where you have your tape in your pic.

Remember now, that will be the tightest area because the motor is mounted on a slight angle. Having said that, I don't think your going to find an extra 4"s, prob more like 1-2" at best. :eek:
That jives with my measurement on a G body, although I forget if I did it to the brake line shield or the actual firewall.

This pic shows a 14" long measurement. The lower you go the more clearance there is (in this simplified diagram) because the angle the engine is mounted but 14" would need to go basically below to the oil pan I think haha. :p

What exactly is the 14" measurement go to? A bracket or something on the outer edge of the compressor housing?

Does the compressor housing get "smaller" if you rotate it? I.e. could you clock it and get some space?

 

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SON-OF_A!!!!! That's a tight area.
Man I sure hope the 2dr has a bit more "room to move" in there.
9 inches! YOW; that blew my mind just now.
I'm now even dumber, and even MORE FULLsignsoflife



Damn Doc, if Randy's measurements match the 2dr's,
it may end up on my coffee table for good.:confused:

I gotta go lay down for a while. lol :barf:
eah
you already wanted to reconfigure the heater box so there's really nothing a sheet metal shoebox welded or riveted into a retangular hole in the firewall can't fix

brake line can always be rerouted across the crossmember instead

edit:
once you own an air powered body saw there's not much you can't modify ... or get outta the way
it's like a sawsall - but about 1/3 the size - and pretty cheep too
 

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eah
you already wanted to reconfigure the heater box so there's really nothing a sheet metal shoebox welded or riveted into a retangular hole in the firewall can't fix

brake line can always be rerouted across the crossmember instead
ya this is true

this isnt that bad. considering how much modification you are doing to the car this is just a little blip on the radar
 

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So 9" +/- 0.25" is your measurement?

And is that to the brake line shield or literally to the firewall?
As close as I can tell 9 inches is about what it is and that's to the firewall itself not the heat shield. My engine probably sits a bit different since I have a home made 4th mount. At rest it tilts my engine slightly forward so I'm thinking some might even have a little less room behind the head than does mine.
 

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As close as I can tell 9 inches is about what it is and that's to the firewall itself not the heat shield. My engine probably sits a bit different since I have a home made 4th mount. At rest it tilts my engine slightly forward so I'm thinking some might even have a little less room behind the head than does mine.
This is great info thanks!!
 

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Here is an updated model based on RGL10's measurements.

I would take this with many grains of salt since there are several approximations used to make it. I.e. use it for +/- 1" accuracy not +/- 0.1", and bet on the smaller side.

SOL22: It looks like the intake I'm making probably wont fit an L body unless I make the runners much shorter. So if you are interested in one, at the very least it will mean doing some more precise measurements of your particular engine bay with your turbo and everything already in there. Or something like that!

 

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Discussion Starter #173
SOL22: I may be able to help you with determining clearance somehow before you actually install it, if that would be useful. If RGL10 tells me the distance from the head gasket surface to the firewall, and you tell me some measurements of your turbo, I can draw it up in my SW model and post up the results here.
I should have time today to get out there and measure everything again.
I'll get more precise numbers for the 351, with the header.

Just took a measurement on the Charger and I get about 9 3/4- 10" from the firewall straight across to the edge of the head where you have your tape in your pic.

Remember now, that will be the tightest area because the motor is mounted on a slight angle. Having said that, I don't think your going to find an extra 4"s, prob more like 1-2" at best. :eek:
I think it may be time to "simply"(yeah right; lol) mount the bare block with the head and turbo in the bay.
Make some marks, and begin to modify the firewall.
I have access to all kinds of metal, and a great MIG.

And, then modifying the heater box, or even deleting it completely is always an option.
(My thoughts there are; when will I need heat anyway? If it's cold enough to have to use heat,
probably not a day I'll want a 400+FWHP, 2200lb car on the road; right?)


SOL22: I dont have your custom exhaust header, but I do have stock exhaust manifolds and I can model the location of the flange the turbo mounts to.

If you can give me basic dimensions for the parts of the turbo you think would hit the firewall, I can "mount it" in the model to the stock exhaust manifold, and see where it stands as far as ballpark fitment.

And you can tell me how the flange location of your tubular header is different from the stock manifold (if it is) and I can adjust for that.

You never know with fitment, unless its really obvious, who knows it might squeeze in there. Or at least we could see how much hammering you are going to have to do!
This would be great Asa. You still DA MAN my friend.
Before I get out there to get the numbers, I can tell you the header keeps the turbo at the same angle,
and distance from the head.
However, it moves it to the left considerably.


SOL22: It looks like the intake I'm making probably wont fit an L body unless I make the runners much shorter. So if you are interested in one, at the very least it will mean doing some more precise measurements of your particular engine bay with your turbo and everything already in there. Or something like that!
Asa, at the very least, I'll need 4 of the flanges. :brows:
I think my guy at Aerostructures can handle the rest.

If it comes to this, I'll most likely use arced runners, which would then position the plenum a bit higher up.
IOW; From the flange, the runner would gradually turn upward 10°-15° until they meet the plenum.
(Would it be possible to draw this up in SW? And would it be a lot of trouble for you?)

BTW: Thank you to everyone for getting into this conversation here.
NOW is the best time to discuss such matters; rather than when I'd be dropping in the drivetrain and screaming WTF?!!!

lol; thanks my friends.
I'll return with some measurements for the HOLSET.:D
 

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Discussion Starter #174
eah
you already wanted to reconfigure the heater box so there's really nothing a sheet metal shoebox welded or riveted into a retangular hole in the firewall can't fix

brake line can always be rerouted across the crossmember instead

edit:
once you own an air powered body saw there's not much you can't modify ... or get outta the way
it's like a sawsall - but about 1/3 the size - and pretty cheep too
This is probably the direction I'll be forced to take.
ALL benefits way I see it though;
Making room, AND losing a bit of weight. :brows:

I'm a fan of the control one has with the air saw, but the friggin' noise is sometimes unbearable. lol
I'll be using the SawsAll to remove the spare tire tub for relocating the fuel tank,
so maybe(if I can get it in there properly) I can use it for the firewall as well.

Man, cutting up a GLHS. Maybe I really am FULLsignsoflife. lol :puzzled:
 

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Does the compressor housing get "smaller" if you rotate it? I.e. could you clock it and get some space?
Yes, the center section vs turbine housing is off set, so you Can gain some space by rotating it some and obviously from running the smallest part of the compressor housing "snail" to the firewall side.

Keep in mind though, the oil drain angle will dictate where the center section needs to be, so it's kind of down to how you run the compressor housing +/- 1/4" from rocking the center section before loosing your oil drain angle.
 

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And, then modifying the heater box, or even deleting it completely is always an option.
(My thoughts there are; when will I need heat anyway? If it's cold enough to have to use heat,
probably not a day I'll want a 400+FWHP, 2200lb car on the road; right?)
From what you've said, I don't think you will be happy without a heater. I bet you will feel better in the long run if you somehow keep the heater functional.

Asa, at the very least, I'll need 4 of the flanges. :brows:
I think my guy at Aerostructures can handle the rest.
Sounds good!

If it comes to this, I'll most likely use arced runners, which would then position the plenum a bit higher up.
IOW; From the flange, the runner would gradually turn upward 10°-15° until they meet the plenum.
(Would it be possible to draw this up in SW? And would it be a lot of trouble for you?)

Yep I can do all that. It wouldn't be too much trouble, and it might even be helpful to me since it would provide an L-body compatible design option.

Why were you thinking the 2 door might have more room? I'm not familiar with the L-bodies...derp

In regards to having the block in the car so you can do fitment, I would have been totally effed without the ability to walk out to the garage and drop my tubular exhaust mani/custom intake/whatever into the engine bay and check fitment. I think you will reap the rewards if you suffer the pains to get that arranged so you can do that. Worth it imo!
 

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Yes, the center section vs turbine housing is off set, so you Can gain some space by rotating it some and obviously from running the smallest part of the compressor housing "snail" to the firewall side.

Keep in mind though, the oil drain angle will dictate where the center section needs to be, so it's kind of down to how you run the compressor housing +/- 1/4" from rocking the center section before loosing your oil drain angle.
He cant locate the center section as needed for optimum drain angle (assuming all the hoses clear), and then arbitrarily rotate the compressor housing without changing the drain angle? :confused:

I think you actually explained this in your sentence but for some reason I cant compute it.
 

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Discussion Starter #178
Went out with the tape measure, and got what I hope will be help ful measurements.

This is from the HOLSET compressor housing's furthest point, to the head:
(However, I will save 2" of this right off the bat when I chop the factory WG can mount from the Compressor housing,
and re-attach it where I need it)






(^ Tape measure is right against the Intake/Exhaust side of the head in the above pic ^)

Here's the width of the HOLSET, including the Snail outlet on the Compressor Housing:


Next: Not really a measurement, but the clearance(or positioning) of the header Outlet as opposed to the head:
(It really moves the turbo to the driver's side quite a bit) :D

(^ Disregard the numbers on the meter stick; I used it for the straight edge only ^)

Lastly, here's a couple perspective shots:




OK; there you have it.
Hope you can do something with this Asa.
Thanks for the effort bro.......See? DA MAN! :D
 

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Went out with the tape measure, and got what I hope will be help ful measurements.

OK; there you have it.
Hope you can do something with this Asa.
Thanks for the effort bro.......See? DA MAN! :D
I just PM'd you twice in a row btw. That second PM is because I just realized there might be a problem with the flanges working because of the 655 head. :(

Your new measurements seem to confirm some things :eek:

I mean if we just go by RGL10's measurements, at 9" you have the firewall (possibly less)...that looks like it might even cut into your turbine housing and maybe even the center section. Yikes.

Do you have your stock turbo? It might be worth bolting it up and seeing how far it protrudes just to triple-check that this is all real.
 

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Discussion Starter #180
...there's really nothing a sheet metal shoebox welded or riveted into a retangular hole in the firewall can't fix
I just PM'd you twice in a row btw. That second PM is because I just realized there might be a problem with the flanges working because of the 655 head. :(
replied; It's a 782 in the pic.
I'll be using a 287, "G".

Your new measurements seem to confirm some things :eek:

I mean if we just go by RGL10's measurements, at 9" you have the firewall (possibly less)...that looks like it might even cut into your turbine housing and maybe even the center section. Yikes.
I may have ventured into a position where I'll use the Doc's solution(quoted above)

Do you have your stock turbo? It might be worth bolting it up and seeing how far it protrudes just to triple-check that this is all real.
Nah man, sold it a while back to afford the 351. lol

It'll get figured out.
My mind is going in different directions with the heater box.
Like, who says I HAVE TO use an "L" body box?
Maybe there's some heater box to be found out in a JY, that will bolt in, and around my new firewall. lol
OH, you all KNOW I'll check into this cRaZy idea further! I have no choice. :brows:
 
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