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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I recently purchased a 90 Voyager with the 2.5 Turbo and a 5 speed manual. I was told that the ECM was bad, and needed replaced. Well, I took it out, and it say it is part number 5235615, which is from a 90 Caravan, 2.5T, 5 sp, Fed emis. This is EXACTLY what I need, except I have a voyager, not a caravan. I checked the codes, and three codes came up: 12, 23, 55. I know 12, and 55 are nothing. 23 says the Air Charge Tempature Sensor is faulty. I searched that damn van ALL over, and can not find that sensor. I am sure it does not exist on my car. So I would like to know, why it will throw the code for a sensor that does not exist on my van. I would also like to know why it wont start. I have yet to check for air/fuel/spark (I know, I know, thats the FIRST thing to check) but I will get to it this weekend. This van will turn over, and ALMOST run, but just wont catch. It is SOOOOO close. I feel like there is no spark, but like I said, I have yet to check for a/f/s. Anyone have any ideas on the code? Do I need the 5235601, or will the 5235615 work? I am new to turbos, and new to the van. I hope to get pics of it in action soon.

-Zach
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I have spark, and I have air. I can smell fuel on the plugs. They had some carbon buildup on them, so I cleaned them off. Once I cleaned them, and pulled the plug to check spark, the damn thing ran, albeit shitty, it ran. My dad shut it off, and then I put the plug back in. It starts, but dies as soon as I give it gas. I know there is a little bit of fuel in the tank, I can hear it when I knock on the tank. I also know its gettting fuel since I can smell it on the plugs. I will check the pressure and see what I find.
 

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Static fuel pressure (at 0 atmospheric pressure) si around 55. Subtract 1 psi for every 2in/hg of vaccum. On the assumption this is a healthy motor, 17-20 in/hg vacuum sould be present at idle, which brings your fuel pressure to 46 ish.

Before checking anything else, be sure your vacuum lines are all secure, and uncracked. If you have a cracked line, that can cause idle issues, fuel consumption, poor driveability, and hard starting.

You could have a weak fuel pump, FPR, or fuel filter. If the filter was replaced, that eliminates that from the equation. The FPR should hold pressure steady, if it is bouncing all over the place it could need replaced. Also check the fuel lines, if they are old, they could have degraded internally and be restricting flow. If you are cautious and the hard fuel lines look in good shape, you can usually blow them out with an air compressor.

Right now it could be a muititude of things, but at least you have it running.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
It actually is not running. When I can get it to run, which is only after pulling all 4 plugs, and cleaning them, it will run VERY rough for anywhere between 2 - 5 seconds before it sputters and dies on its own. Then, it will not start again without letting it sit for several minutes, or cleaning the plugs again. Once the plugs are clean, they look fresh. They are Bosch Platinums is looks like.

After buying the Haynes it says that with the regulator's vacuum disconnected it should have 39 psi at the test port. I checked it, and I have about 41 psi. So I am thinking then that the fuel system as a whole is functioning.

That leads me back to the ECM. Since I have 5235615, and not 5235601, could it need to be flashed over to my VIN and mileage? If so, is there a way I can do that from home, or for cheap? Does it even need to be flashed? How can I tell if it is flashed to my van?
Anyone live near Sacramento, CA have one of these that I can borrow the ECM for 5 minutes to see if it is in fact the ECM, lol? Seriously though, is there?
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
The fuel pressure was bouncing all over until I replaced the fuel filter, and now it is steady, so that sounds like it eliminates the FPR as well.
I am thinking the problem is the ECM now, not fuel. I think it needs to be flashed, since the ECM in there is from a caravan not a voyager. Its still a 90 2.5 T, 5 speed, Fed emissions. The ECM is still the same as mine, its just for a Caravan, not a Voyager.
Is there a way to check to see if it is flashed to my Voyager, and if its not, can I flash it myself?
 

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The engine controller has nothing to do with fuel pressure, it only controls injector pulse width according to inputs from the Map Sensor(dominant fuel control sensor) Coolant Temp Sensor, Air Charge Temp Sensor(if equipped) Throttle Position Sensor, Oxygen Sensor(fuel trimmer)
It does all of this "assuming" that fuel pressure, ignition components and all other engine mechanical aspects are correct.
Caravan/Voyager 2.5L turbo controllers would be the same.
The only differences would be auto/manual trans and that would affect idle control on decel.

So to review...
Your problem is a cranks but won't start or starts and stalls with fuel fouled plugs???
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
The engine controller has nothing to do with fuel pressure, it only controls injector pulse width according to inputs from the Map Sensor(dominant fuel control sensor) Coolant Temp Sensor, Air Charge Temp Sensor(if equipped) Throttle Position Sensor, Oxygen Sensor(fuel trimmer)
It does all of this "assuming" that fuel pressure, ignition components and all other engine mechanical aspects are correct.
Caravan/Voyager 2.5L turbo controllers would be the same.
The only differences would be auto/manual trans and that would affect idle control on decel.

So to review...
Your problem is a cranks but won't start or starts and stalls with fuel fouled plugs???
I am thinking since it is throwing the code for the ACT, that is does not have, that is why its not running correctly. That then would cause it to run rough, and or not at all right?
 

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I had problems with the ACT Sensor on my car and they only reason I knew there was an issue was the CEL was illuminated, no driveabilty issues.
The ACT does not have enough authority to make the system go black rich.
 

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Also if you are setting an ACT Code 23 your controller had to come from a T-2, T-3 or
T-4.
The T-1 did not use an ACT Sensor.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Well dammit. I don't want to buy an ECM if its not the problem. I have air fuel and spark. The timing appears to be good as well. I have not pulled the timing cover off, but when its at TDC, the module is pointing to number 1 in the distributor, so I am assuming that everything is ok. Maybe I will have to pull the cover and see what it looks like.
I am curious why it is running rich though.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Also if you are setting an ACT Code 23 your controller had to come from a T-2, T-3 or
T-4.
The T-1 did not use an ACT Sensor.
How do I know if I do or not? I looked at a how to of how to install the sensor on T-M.com and they said to pull that wire. Well, that wire is NOT in my ECM. So I am confused how it is even hooked up.
 

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You have fuel and spark but not in the proper amounts.
Do not comdem a controller until all basics have been verified to be correct.
Step back, take adeep breath and relax and start from square 1 with a clear mind.
The problem is there, you just have to find it.
I/we will be with you so you are not alone.
It is usually cheaper to buy the basic tools to diagnose than to throw parts at the problem.

Here are some basic diagnostics for Cam Timing, Fuel Pressure, Map Output Voltage.
If you have any questions feel free to ask.

http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f14/359212-cam-timing-belt-tension-84-95-a.html

http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f14/358339-checking-fuel-pressure-84-93-turbo.html

http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f14/344296-code-13-diagnostics.html
 

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Just take your time and be sure all the basics are correct.
One tooth off on the Cam is 9 degrees at the Cam and 18 degrees at the crank and one/two teeth off is a common issue.
Once that is done verify fuel pressure then Map voltage with key on/engine off, engine cranking, engine running.
The controller makes all of its calculations from sensor input and "assumes" all engine basics are correct so when it makes fuel corrections it expects certain things to happen.
If fuel pressure or engine vacuum are not correct the controllers corrections will not be correct.
 

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No gaskets and the upper cover is only 3 bolts.
2 on the valve cover and 1 on the lower side where it bolts to the lower cover and it comes right off.
 
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