Turbo Dodge Forums banner
1 - 13 of 13 Posts

· Registered
Joined
·
230 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Has anyone tried the Allison Transynd in their A413, or any auto trans for that matter? After doing quite a bit of research on synthetic ATF, I decided to try the Transynd and just recently drained and filled my A413 with the stuff. Now it heats up more than I like. It used to get to around 120 and stay, but now it shoots up to 160 and climbs up more on the highway.:confused:

Thanks.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
230 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
My trans temp sensor sits inline before the cooler. It climbs past 160F during my 25 mile trip to work, but I'm worried about a longer cruise. It may go higher, and I'm afraid to find out.

I must explain myself here. Why did I go with TranSynd? It's compatable with Dexron III and it's synthetic. I wanted a synthetic for long trips where I'll be towing a trailer. I used Dexron III instead of ATF+3 and had zero problems for two years. But I also know that Dexron (and maybe TranSynd?) has a lower friction coefficient than ATF+3 or ATF+4. However, since I had no problems with Dexron III, I decided to go with TranSynd.

It has been said that ATF+4 has a seal incompatibility issue with the older trans. My transaxle is out of a '89 Plymouth T1 and was rebuilt with a new Mopar A413 overhaul kit. I'm not positive which seals it provided nor do I know if they are compatible with ATF+4.

Has anyone ran ATF+4 in the older A413 and seen these seal problems? If not, then I'll remove the TranSynd and put in ATF+4 as ATF+3 isn't available anymore. I could put Dexron III back in, but I should use what the factory recommended.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
2,028 Posts
I know turbovanman(Simon) has been running synthetic dexron for awhile w/o issues, he said to save some money and just use that.

The drag racers are using Tractor hydraulic fluid instead of Type F which many used to use.

Well I guess you still cant link to the other site:bang head
 

· Old School Hot Rodder
Joined
·
1,788 Posts
I have been using MOPAR ATF+4 in my A413 since I built it 3 or 4 years ago with no problems. It seems to be a synthetic equivilant of type F fluid as far as friction qualities go. Dexron and it's updates were created by GM originally as both a synthetic oil and to "soften" the shift feel. Years ago Hot Rod Magazine had an article comparing the friction vs. clamping force. Dexron started off with less friction and built up, type F started with more initial friction. The end result at full apply was the same. Type F and ATF+4 give a "crisper" shift feel.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
230 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Update time.

A friend of mine who does plenty of transmission work told me transmissions usually rises to the same temperature as the engine as both are connected together. As long as the transmission matches engine temperature, there's no problem. Yesterday I rodded the car plenty on the way home (and I shan't tell you how fast :D) just to see what the temperature climbs to. It went no higher than the engine's temp (190F) and when I let off, both the trans & engine temps drop together to 165F. Very interesting!

I am used to the slow temp rise of Dexron III, and I guess I freaked out watching the trans temp rise faster than expected with TranSynd. But maybe that's a good thing. I read that TranSynd has the same friction dynamic coefficient as ATF+3, but it's "dual viscosity", meaning it retains the same viscosity at hot & cold temperatures. The new ATF+4 from Mopar and Valvoline is the same. I know of two tricks used to bring the trans temp up quickly to reduce wear. One is to use a radiator trans cooler and the other is a cooler bypass valve in the valve body (Dodge Neon A413s have this feature). Maybe TranSynd & ATF+4 resolved this problem with their dual viscosity properties so neither the radiator cooler or cooler bypass are needed? If so, that makes things a lot easier! :drinking:

I'll watch more and report in later.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
79 Posts
I'm using Walmart TDH UTF in an A670 (A413 in V6 bellhousing) , since August last year. Made from high VI group 3 base stocks, so damn close to synth as far as properties go. Works great.
I have a turbo mini with a 3 speed auto non lock up converter will this stuff be ok in my type of tranny and will this stuff get along with dex/merc if mixed. I have to change fluid/filter because my tranny's governer is not shifting back into 1st at stoplights. I plan on using seafoam and then new filter/fluids. Do I have to drain the whole tranny and torque converter. If so, how would I drain the tc.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
2,295 Posts
i had the local ford dealer do a synthetic flush on my 89 lesabre (3.8 fwd, 4 speed overdrive) when i bought it and it has been great for the last 4 years. i plan to run mobil synthetic atf in the k wagon!
 

· Registered
Joined
·
230 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Final Update:

After driving with the Allison Transynd in my A413 for several months, I have definite proof it's not compatible. Here's the data in the order of modification:

Overall gear ratio: 3.22
Fluid: Dexron III
MPG: 25
Trans temp on freeway: 130

Overall gear ratio: 3.02
Fluid: Transynd
MPG: 18:eek:
Trans temp on freeway: 190

Overall gear ratio: 2.6
Fluid: Transynd
MPG: 22
Trans temp on freeway: 190

Overall gear ratio: 3.02
Fluid: Dexron III
MPG: 25:D
Trans temp on freeway: 140:thumb:

Note how the temperature is still slightly higher after I flushed out the Transynd and put Dexron III back in. There must be a small amount remaining. I'll flush it again for good measure.

I don't have exact knowledge as to what caused this drop in MPG (performance too!) and increased heat, but I feel the torque converter was the culprit as it may have been incompatible with the Transynd. Maybe Transynd requires a different TC design?

Well, this was a failed experiment, but what's life without adventure? A good friend of mine who raced NHRA Comp Eliminator said that in experiments like this, 90% is research & development. Only 10% of the parts, fluids, & procedures tested are actually used to race.

I hope everyone can get some useful information from this. I have more MPG experiments lined up. Stay tuned.
 

· Registered
Joined
·
1 Posts
Synthetics run a little hotter in Trans and Rearends because of there properties. They have better lubrication at low and high temps and less breakdown at high temp. Transynd should not make your temp go up if you were running synthetics before. Also Transynd will not cause damage. I have run it for years in HD equipment and all of my personal vehicles with no problems. If you flushed out transynd and you still have high temp sounds like something else is wrong. Temp sensor, cooler blocked. etc. I would still recommend transynd in your transmission.
 
1 - 13 of 13 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top