[amcpacer]

I have access to a Maserati DOHC engine and transmission including the wiring harness for a relatively cheap price. The problem is the engine had an oil pump failure and seized up. The cylinders do not have any scoring so it may actually be a rod bearing that seized up. I am seriously considering getting this engine and rebuilding it for my 85XE laser. I am wondering if it is possible to get replacement parts for these engines. Do they use the same rings as a standard 2.2 engine? Also I would not be able to get a Maserati gear shift and cables and I assume my 525 shifter and cables would not work with the Maserati transmission. I will not be using my car for racing but it would be nice to get a little more power than the T1 draw through allows. Has anyone here had any experience with a Maserati engine swap? What kind of expenses should I expect for such a project? I found a write up on the TC at this website: Chrysler's TC by Maserati cars at the bottom of the article it mentions difficulty in finding replacement bearings.

 

[marty mopar]

only 500 DOHC 16V TC engines built (or close to it). Virtually all the stuff on the engine & trans is different and there is NO aftermarket for the stuff. Good luck finding stuff for it.

 

[2.216vturbo]

The way I understand the replacement rings/bearings/pistons issue is that Maserati wanted to make some $$$ back on the service items hence the specific to that model carnk/rods/pistons etc. There are no rings that I know of, no pistons and certainly no bearings, believe me I have tried as I do have a couple DOHC Maserati powered cars. As Martin already said, there is virtually no aftermarket demand for the parts so don't count on any stuff being repopped any time soon

Alan

 

[4Daytonas]

Re-read the article .Different rods are used in this engine ,but can be swapped out with Chrysler stuff.basically it's just a 2.2 with a different 16 valve head .btw which is actually a better head than the t111 heads.Everything is interchangeable with Chrysler stuff.Only the body was built in Italy.Put the head on your engine or use a common block and build a better set-up.You'll have to get some custom pistons to match the head.Any aft'mkt piston supplier will do them.

 

[amcpacer]

I noticed the pistons have quite a deep circular dish inside of them. Also there were rather deep valve reliefs. I wonder how this head would perform if it were bolted to a 2.5CB engine. It may work well since the pistons do not come to the top of the cylinder in a 2.5. If I were to sell the complete engine/trans on ebay what kind of value might they be worth? With the scarce replacement parts it looks like I may be better off turning down the offer or possibly buying it for the purpose of selling it to fund a modded T2 swap.

 

[2.216vturbo]

Re-read the article .Different rods are used in this engine ,but can be swapped out with Chrysler stuff.basically it's just a 2.2 with a different 16 valve head .btw which is actually a better head than the t111 heads.Everything is interchangeable with Chrysler stuff.Only the body was built in Italy.Put the head on your engine or use a common block and build a better set-up.You'll have to get some custom pistons to match the head.Any aft'mkt piston supplier will do them.

Uh, yeah, sounds like you've really done the swap right? Everything is interchangeable? Can you get rod bearings for the motor? I'll pay you $100 a set for them... If you use a common block under that head, how are you gonna drive the cams? Custom round tooth crank gear and cam gears I suppose... No problem any decent machine shop can make those for $400-$500 each. Oh, and a belt to fit those gears...

Yes, IMO it IS a better head than the TIII but there is not so much interchange as was pointed out by our experienced friend who "read an artical" about the swap.:bash:

Alan

 

[2.216vturbo]

I noticed the pistons have quite a deep circular dish inside of them. Also there were rather deep valve reliefs. I wonder how this head would perform if it were bolted to a 2.5CB engine. It may work well since the pistons do not come to the top of the cylinder in a 2.5. If I were to sell the complete engine/trans on ebay what kind of value might they be worth? With the scarce replacement parts it looks like I may be better off turning down the offer or possibly buying it for the purpose of selling it to fund a modded T2 swap.

Well, you do already have one offer don't you? There are a few TC Maserati owners on this list

Oh, and there are no clutches/seals/synchros or any other service items for that trans either, in fact, go to Getrag of North America's website (the original manufacturer) they list all the transmissions they made over the years but they don't claim responsibility for the 284 from the TC's

Alan

 

[amcpacer]

I guess I should take my time and see just how low a price I can get the Engine and Trans for. They wanted 600 for the setup which is a good deal to me because I would not have to spend money trying to get the parts together for a neon DOHC swap. I can get a better deal if I do some various mechanical work for the family that has the setup. I am still having dreams of seeing Maserati staring out from under the Laser hood!

I should go back over and pull a bearing cap for the connecting rod and see if there is any scoring. I am sure bearings would be a necessity because the engine will not rotate at all.

So what makes it a better head than the TIII? The TIII has more horsepower stock than the Masi and the TIII does not have a distributor.

 

[GLHNSLHT2]

Give me the address, I'll go have a look over for ya. It'd be cool to see a masi in a Laser. Don't think it's been done yet.

 

[2.216vturbo]

Give me the address, I'll go have a look over for ya. It'd be cool to see a masi in a Laser. Don't think it's been done yet.

Gee Jay, I think you forgot to mention to AMC that you are building your own Masi Project, not that you would be interested in those parts:shrug: ... Just gonna drive 400+ miles to 'have a look'?


Alan

 

[GLHNSLHT2]

Alan I don't need any parts I have everything I need for the motor. You want the stock shortblock? It's just sitting on my garage floor collecting dust.

Besides 400 miles is only 1 tank of gas in the Tona if that! 40+MPG highway rocks!

My head is with Rick D right now soon to have the works done to it.

 

[xtrempickup]

thoguht about doing it in my 84 laser but decided the rampage would be better considering

 

[The Pope]

After looking at one up close, at Jays I can say you don't want the masi bottom end anyway. Way too heavy built, not like race car 1,000 heavy, more like low RPM Cummins heavy. Get an early oil pump shaft and a 89 T2 bottom end, or even a mini van 2.5 bottom end. Then buy new 16v forged pistons. The top end can be left stock except for the valves. The engine also needs the exhaust manifold modded to use a regular turbo, not the POS IHI they came with. I would also coat everything in the head, cams, combustion chamber, valves and lash caps so they don't ware that bad. I would also use a later 91 523 with an OBX over the factory Masi 284 Getrag. Keep everything you need to make the 16v work, the belts and pulleys and so on. Sell the short block, turbo and trans on Ebay and make the money to do the rebuild.

Though many of us like the novelty of the 16v engines, I do too. Fact is for the trouble there not really worth it. Spirit R/Ts and the Masi 16vs can't be a daily driver, once you run out of parts your done. So they need to be a low mileage toy. Power? Sure you can make more power. But 450 WHP is a bolt on today with an 8v engine, and you can buy parts for them. The Masi is pretty tough, but it is a rich mans engine for his garage decoration. Not for racing unless you can feed $ into it when ever it has a problem. Whats an intake worth $900 for a stock one? If power is what you want and a driver, sell the Masi engine in pieces and make the $. Then build a brand new 8v valve with massive power, more than what can even be used in a street car. Or restore the Daytona, build a sweet Masi engine for it and take it out cruizing on nice days. Everyone that trys to really drive one becomes a whiner, it is a matter of time. How much is a good valve cover gasket and timing belt going for these days Alan? You can bet Alan is under some stress like everyone else driving them.

 

[amcpacer]

I went back and examined the bearing surfaces in the camshafts and found them to be in excellent shape. I did not have any tools with me at the time to pull a connecting rod cap.

Does the Getrag Maserati transmission use special axles or can I use any large spline G-body axle?

GLHNSLHT2 I just may be interested in your short-block. That way I could just bolt the head on connect the transmission and drop it in the laser. By the way how are you getting 40mpg out of a Daytona? My laser XE driven at the rural speed limit 55mph staying out of boost except when climbing hills can only get 27mpg. It only sees approximately 19mpg city in the winter time. Oh well if I can get the 16V engine in there maybe it will see better milage.

I would probably make my own custom cal for the Maserati based off of an 87 TII computer instead of running the Maserati electronics. That way I could run higher boost and have access to all of the cool things in the blueberry cals like check engine flash when knock is detected. I already have an eeprom burner.

 

[The Pope]

I went back and examined the bearing surfaces in the camshafts and found them to be in excellent shape. I did not have any tools with me at the time to pull a connecting rod cap.

Does the Getrag Maserati transmission use special axles or can I use any large spline G-body axle?

GLHNSLHT2 I just may be interested in your short-block. That way I could just bolt the head on connect the transmission and drop it in the laser. By the way how are you getting 40mpg out of a Daytona? My laser XE driven at the rural speed limit 55mph staying out of boost except when climbing hills can only get 27mpg. It only sees approximately 19mpg city in the winter time. Oh well if I can get the 16V engine in there maybe it will see better milage.

I would probably make my own custom cal for the Maserati based off of an 87 TII computer instead of running the Maserati electronics. That way I could run higher boost and have access to all of the cool things in the blueberry cals like check engine flash when knock is detected. I already have an eeprom burner.

The trans doesn't have an extension on the passenger side like the others. Alan could chime in on the trans but the Masi TC 16v axles fit the trans and the Daytona. GLHNSLH uses the sweet LC-1 with D cal for the mileage. Other than the short block you should get his bin files

 

[xtrempickup]

the axles are different than any other car made etc i was told. there are performance cals that Cindy and Rick D are selling for the Masi16V. I'll be sticking it in something, its got Rick D for aftermarket parts so if you really want to spend the cash, you can make a 600HP monster as Rick makes the parts to do it with.

 

[2.216vturbo]

Yeah +1 to what Extreme said, axles will not interchange, they are a whole different size on the inners. If you wanted to you *could* use the whole transmission and axles in the Laser with custom mounts and adapting the shifter from the TC as well. The axle 'outers' have the same splines and the overall dimension from hub to hub is the same on a Laser or a TC Masi. Hope you never need another clutch though...

But then again, I'm just using my Masi's for what was it Orthodonti, oh yeah, 'Garage Decoration'


Alan

 

[xtrempickup]

i love garage decorations that sound and goo faster than non decorations

 

[amcpacer]

Ok I will be getting the Maserati engine / transmission assembly with wiring computer and axles. I have to go get everything on tuesday.

Now the ideal setup that I want is to mate the cylinder head up to a common block 2500cc engine. Would the compression ratio be way too high with the stock 2.5 pistons? Are there any vendors out there currently selling forged 2.5 pistons that would have a close enough cc to use with this head? Perhaps using an extra thick copper head gasket. Since I can make custom calibrations it may not be too bad to make this a relatively high compression engine anyway.

Now from what I understand the crankshaft timing belt pulley needs to be square tooth. Can a square tooth pulley be pulled off an old 2.2 circa 1985 and bolted to the common block crank shaft?

Also I will need to find an internally gated holset turbocharger from a Dodge Ram Diesel. According to The Pope the stock IHI turbo is crap so an upgrade is a necessity. We do not want to make this thing perform poorly.

 

[The Pope]

Ok I will be getting the Maserati engine / transmission assembly with wiring computer and axles. I have to go get everything on tuesday.

Now the ideal setup that I want is to mate the cylinder head up to a common block 2500cc engine. Would the compression ratio be way too high with the stock 2.5 pistons? Are there any vendors out there currently selling forged 2.5 pistons that would have a close enough cc to use with this head? Perhaps using an extra thick copper head gasket. Since I can make custom calibrations it may not be too bad to make this a relatively high compression engine anyway.

Now from what I understand the crankshaft timing belt pulley needs to be square tooth. Can a square tooth pulley be pulled off an old 2.2 circa 1985 and bolted to the common block crank shaft?

Also I will need to find an internally gated holset turbocharger from a Dodge Ram Diesel. According to The Pope the stock IHI turbo is crap so an upgrade is a necessity. We do not want to make this thing perform poorly.

First what are you WHP goals? 550 WHP? Thats litterally more than what is usable on a street car, great for a stripped down full race car. 300 WHP and the car will fly, much more than that on the street is a waste, you'll spin the tires more than move the car. A S50 T04E will spool super fast on the Masi and make a hair over 400 WHP. Then comes fitting the Holset, the things is huge, making a custom header? The Masi header is like a TBI and will put the Holset right there on the firewall. A Holset is in my garage waiting for my Rampage, but it won't be a street car. A giant turbo can make you much slower on the street. Find out what you want to use the car for and we can help with a turbo choice. Doing a cal custom for it will really be nice