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Microsquirt

8K views 36 replies 10 participants last post by  Tbone 
#1 ·
Experiencing electrical issue with my car, decide it isn't worth my time to troubleshoot if the issues is at the computers or wiring.

Around $700 into parts so far. Microsquirt ecu, 8 ft harness, E85 sensor, 36-1 wheel, crank sensor, butt connectors, heat shrink, connectors, relays, fuel box, E85 quick connectors, QuadSpark Ignition Module, coil, & etc. Still need high impedance injectors and I'm sure other things.

Going to use batch firing and waste spark.

Separating engine harness with body harness.




Mounted.


All needed wires labeled.


Made bracket for crank sensor, using metal from the shifter bracket on top of the transmission. Will have to reinforce the bracket after the crank is welded to 36-1 wheel.




Marked where the 36-1 wheel needed to be welded to the crank pulley.


Need to find someone to cut the ring gear and weld to the crank pulley.
 
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#11 ·
I'm wanting to do a MegaSquirt setup on one of my cars, but I'm just afraid of the wiring of fuse blocks.
Get yourself some non-insulated butt connectors, crimp tool, heat strink, match box, and you'll wonder why you took so long to convert to fuseblock.

Hardest thing will be finding a place and making a bracket for the fuseblock.
 
#13 · (Edited)
edit , never mind I found it - "only" 170 cca I think I'll pass

any spec's on the battery?

I found a "anti gravity" brand battery - 6 x 5 x 3 x 3.5 pounds , 600 cca .. $400 + with lithium battery charger included

yeah , 400 bucks is a bit rich on price

also looking for stand alone battery terminals for a remote battery install with posts still in the engine compartment

I tried googleing the battery you show but my slow internet connection won't allow anything that came up to load
 
#14 ·
I just did emission and the car runs cleaner than it ever did on stock computer. I will definitely pick up more MPG as I can set cruising at 16:1 vs stock 13.7-14.1:1 ratio. I noticed when I set ignition timing with stock computer and distributor at idle speed, timing always jumps from between 10 BDC to 14BDC, it would NEVER settle at just 12 BDC like the factory manual calls for. With Microsquirt and a 36-1 wheel, ignition timing is bang on EVERY time.

Very happy with result and money well spent.
 
#17 · (Edited)
Current total is $1470, though I still have stuff I need to sorted out, which means more $$$. If you plan everything well and have all the parts, you can probably wire the car and started in a weekend. HOWEVER, as this is custom job, you'll come upon custom issue that will stop you dead cold, like making a crank sensor bracket, or get the 36-1 wheel onto the crank, getting parts, ...etc.

Microsquirt + 8 ft harness $369
36-1 wheel $32.00
Weld 36-1 wheel to crank $100
crank sensor $43
QuadSpark $89.00
MAP sensor connector $8.50
MAT sensor connector $10.00
ECT sensor connector $10.00
TPS sensor connector $10.00
420A wires $20
420A coil $20
Wiring Connector packs $30
USB to serial $15
Misc wires $40
Uninsulated crimp $20
Crimp tool $13
Shrink Wrap $10
Misc bolts $15
Relay $15
Fusebox $25
Fuses $5
E85 sensor + connector $80
knocksense $80 - looking to sell it
Injector resister $30
wire loop $20
On/off Solenoid valve for idle control $30
3m tape $6
Tuner Studio + Megaviwer $80
lilknockmeter -$119.95
BOSCH knock sensor 0261231038 -$25.00
TPS connector for knock sensor -$11.95
Balanced crank pulley -$74.31
step down stud for knock sensor N90905502 -$2.49
 
#18 · (Edited)
I've been asked about the knock system I use, so I thought I write it down.

MS2/Microsquirt only accept knock sensor with a knock module, and most of the knock modules has only a output of 0-5V digital on/off. I wanted something more, and I found lilknockmeter.

Features of lilknockmeter are:
A set of LEDs from green to yellow to orange and red, giving you the severity of knocks (LED lights is adjustable via software)
Audio jack output (use headphone to listen to knock!)
0-5v on/off digital output
0-5v analogue output
Software to calibrate the lilknockmeter

I was very happy to find lilknockmeter, you will not find another product with all these features and this low price! Product is made in California, great support from the Leonard, the lilknockmeter creator!

I used the parts below for my install.

A knock module call lilknockmeter, https://www.ebay.com/itm/Knock-sens...ash=item440d29f41f:g:ecAAAOxyUylTUcSv&vxp=mtr, made by Insane Import Performance
a VW BOSCH knock sensor 0261231038 (3 wire knock sensor, signal, ground, and ground for the shielding)
VW N90905502 m10x1.5 to m8x1.25 stud, $2-$3 at VW dealer
M8x1.25 washer
M8x1.25 nut
3 wire BOSCH sensor connector, https://www.ebay.com/itm/B1-Rectang...e=STRK:MEBIDX:IT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649

Stock Chrysler knock sensor is mounted on the intake manifold between number 2 and number 3 runner.
The knock sensor is now mounted at the AC bracket at the block between the 1st and 2nd cylinder.


Lilknockmeter is wired up in the car with 12v, ground,0-5V analogue going to Microsquirt, and the shielded cable going to the knock sensor.

My current lilknockmeter software settings are

Frequency = 6.64kHz (I used this to calculate knock frequency https://www.phormula.com/KnockCalculator.aspx)
Gain = 2.0
Time = 240
Threshold = 0500 (0 to 1024 range, corresponds to 0-5V)
Cylinder = 4

Chrysler uses 0-5 V analogue setup, since I can only set up the LED come on at one voltage, I set it at 2.5V
 
#20 ·
Tryingbe
A few questions on micro squirt...or is it megasquirt?
How to control boost on t1?
Is BOV just for T2?

Is microsquirt scanner friendly for troubleshooting?
triggerwheel and ford dis would be no problem.

Are t1 injectors high or low impedance? any problems there? Thought I read something about another board needed for low imp.
Thanks
 
#21 · (Edited)
Tryingbe
A few questions on micro squirt...or is it megasquirt?
There are MegaSquirt 1, MegaSquirt 2, MegaSquirt 3, and MicroSquirt. I have MicroSquirt.

How to control boost on t1?
I use a HDi electronic boost controller. You can use MS to control boost or manual boost controller.

Is BOV just for T2?
BOV is for Blow-thru turbo system, not for Draw-thru.


Is microsquirt scanner friendly for troubleshooting?
You use a laptop or android to read all sensors or review log. There is no scanner, no OBDII, no codes telling you what to look. Troubleshooting would be up to the operator.

Example.


Are t1 injectors high or low impedance? any problems there? Thought I read something about another board needed for low imp.
Thanks

All 80's turbo dodge injectors are low impedance. MS want to use high impedance injectors or you can use resister/peak-and-hold driver with low impedance injectors.
 
#22 ·
thanks for the reply......microsquirt will remain just a consideration for now, but nice to have an evaluation form a working system on the Chrysler 2.2
Does manual boost control mean the original 83/84 boost control setup or something else??
thanks again Land
 
#23 ·
Does manual boost control mean the original 83/84 boost control setup or something else??
thanks again Land
I'm not sure what 83/84 boost control system look like.

Manual boost control means a way to control the amount of air going to the actuator to delay the actuator from opening the lever on the swingvalve/wastegate housing.

It could be a boost leak with orifices, a g-valve, a manual boost controller, etc...

There are hundreds of manual boost controllers out there.
https://www.google.com/search?biw=1......1.1.64.psy-ab..26.21.2040....0.jWSoN0g4Z70

G-valve.
 
#24 ·
Tryingbe......2 more questions please......injector resistors.....are they the tubular 4 pac pictured, and are they to make low impedance act like high imp?? also on/ off sol on same pic....for a low and high idle??? connected where and how? thanks, Land
 
#25 ·
Tryingbe......2 more questions please......injector resistors.....are they the tubular 4 pac pictured, and are they to make low impedance act like high imp??
Correct, injector resistors make low impedance injectors look/act like high impedance injectors as far as the ECU and current is concerned.

The injector resistor I used is BOSCH 0 280 159 018, lots of other car manufacturers also uses injector resistor, Volvo, Toyota, Honda, Nissan, BMW, etc. Injector resistor will change the dead time of the injectors, so it is advisable to measure the injectors dead time afterward. https://www.miataturbo.net/ecus-tuning-54/how-find-your-injector-dead-time-56061/

Some ECU like Dodge is able to handle the low impedance injectors current since they were designed with using low impedance injectors in mind, others are not. You will blow out the injector circuit if you wire multiple low impedance injectors directly to MS without using the injector resistors.

One can also build a peak and hold driver to use low impedance injectors with MS, I didn't go this route, so not much information I can give you.

also on/ off sol on same pic....for a low and high idle??? connected where and how? thanks, Land

MS can use three different types of idle control: stepper motor (4-6 wires) , pulse width modulation (PWN) valve (2-3 wires), and on/off valve/solenoid (2 wires).

Dodge uses a four wire stepper motor with lots of adjustment available, and the stepper motor is installed at the throttle body.

Many European car uses a PWN idler valve plumb directly to the intake manifold to bypass throttle body all together, my Volvo 850 is like that.

Some older cars may uses an on/off idle system just for cold start. I know at least one VW do that.

MS can take the advantage of the wide range of adjustment for both stepper motor and PWN idler and do a close loop feedback for the ideal RPM at whatever engine condition: cold start, coming to a stop, a/c compressor coming on, low battery voltage, hold RPM while you shift, and etc.

On/off valve/solenoid is just that, on or off, with no adjustment. It is a open loop, and MS doesn't monitor it. MS default is to have the on/off valve to be on when coolant temperature is below 140F, and shut the valve off after that, and that is it. It is basically a controlled vacuum leak to achieve a higher idle RPM.

To use stepper motor means I would have to buy an additional controller and also give up 2 additional inputs wires. (I only have two customizable inputs and two customizable outputs with Microsquirt)

To use PWN idler valve would mean I'll need to have a either 1/2 or 5/8 barb ends on intake manifold and I will need to drill and tape my intake manifold for bigger opening.

To use an on/off solenoid, I can just change the existing 1/8 npt with 1/8 barb end that is already on my intake manifold to 1/8 npt with 1/4 barb end.


For my setup, I actually have to use a different solenoid than pictured because I needed something with bigger internal passages to let more air though. I found a valve with 3 mm diameter passages, but it wasn't big enough. I opened up the internal passes on the solenoid to be about 5mm in diameter.

I also wired the on/off solenoid with an additional relay that ties to the the a/c cut out relay, so when a/c compressor is on, my on/off solenoid would automatically turn on without getting an input from MS.

I then warmed up the engine and adjusted the idler screw at the throttle plate until the engine idle to my desire 1000RPM. Then I checked all other idle speed I care about.

Cold idle 1200 RPM
Warm idle 1020 RPM
Warm idle with a/c compressor on 850 RPM

Driving with a/c compressor on takes a little getting used to get a smooth shift since my idle speed drops fast, but it is fine for now.

If I have to take my cylinder head out, I will probably drill out the intake manifold for a bigger barb for a PWN valve, but for now, it works good enough.
 
#27 ·
I just found this thread. Wow! You have answered a lot of questions that were scarring me away from MegaSquirt. Not sure if I will end up going with Mega, or Micro, but at least I now have some info to work with.

Hopefully, you will be up for answering questions, when I actually start making progress.
 
#29 ·
Excellent info, tryingbe. I have a question. Is there a good reason to use the Quadspark rather than the Edis system out of a Ford Escort? I was thinking of grabbing the trigger wheel, sensor, ignition module and coil pack from an Escort. Seems like that would be simple and fairly cheap (junkyard). If the quadspark is better than I would go that route. Just wasn’t sure.
Thanks.
 
#30 · (Edited)
I never heard of anyone with issue with Quadspark as it has four BOSCH BIP373 simple transistors. If you want cheap, buy Bosch BIP373s, heatsink, and build your own.


If you use EDIS, you take away the control of MS and leaving it in the hands of EDIS. You have to setup the tooth wheel very accurately, which you don't in MS. Rev limiter is reported to be built-in into EDIS, but no one can exactly explain it. Anti-lag, not supported. Flat shift, not supported, etc.

Megasquirt Support Forum (MSEXTRA) ? Index page


Do yourself a huge favor and let MS control your spark.
 
#31 ·
I had no idea that using the EDIS would take away my ability to control spark through microsquirt. I assumed the Edis module was similiar to the quadspark and either one could be controlled through the ms. Glad you cleared that one up for me. I’ve got a lot to learn! Thanks
 
#32 ·
I decided to take my first step and bought a quadspark. Next thing I want to figure out is my fuel injectors. I need some big ones, 50 or 60 lb because I want to run E85 so I thought I might as well find some high impedance ones so I don’t need the resistors. Does anyone know what fuel injectors would fit with the existing fuel rail? Or does any EV1 style fuel injector fit?
 
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