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Might have made a mistake.... Fuseable link issue

9K views 112 replies 11 participants last post by  NAJ 
#1 ·
Well guys, here is where I'm at on this project that has gotten a little out of hand.

I bought an 1986 Dodge Omni GLH from a guy in Utah. He advised that it "needed a new fuel pump, and it should run..." Not to say he lied because it did need a new pump, however, that was definitely not all it needed to "run".

Long story short I got it to do just that...run... Sorta... I drove it around a parking lot a few times. Except every time I drove it one of the fuseable links would burn up. I understand that they are there to protect more expensive things from burning up but I think mine were so brittle and old they were just breaking.

I talked to a couple guys around where I live and they suggested to replace the fuseable links with a fuse box from another vehicle.

I went to the pick and pull and found a very simple maxi style fuse box with 8 or so fuses. I read up on the loads for the fuseable links and matched them to the maxi fuses. I even made a crude wiring schematic. So I hooked it all up and....

It cranks but no fuel. I know I have good solid spark to the plugs and the timing wasn't messed with since it was running. I basically just wired the fuses in place of the fuseable links.

I checked voltage to the pump and there is voltage to the gauge but not to the pump itself.

I made a jumper wire for the pump to see if it would come on and I heard a solenoid click in the engine bay but I never heard the pump actually turn on.

I'm overwhelmed and frustrated with the car and need to get it running soon or the wife is going to get rid of it.

I need some help. Thanks in advance and I can get some pics or videos if they would help. I did all this before I noticed the STICKY fuseable link thread.
 
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#28 ·
Assuming you disconnected the CTS with the engine running to bring timing to base...

If you have to turn the distributor that far the intermediate shaft is still not properly aligned.

Bring #1 to TDC on a compression stroke being sure the timing mark on the flywheel is at 0.
Is the mark on the intermediate shaft aligned with the mark on the crank sprocket?
Is the distributor rotor pointing to #1 cylinder on the cap with the distributor in the proper position?

If not
Move the distributor back to its normal position(parallel to the block).
Turn the intermediate shaft until the rotor is aligned with #1 on the distributor cap and make a new mark on the intermediate shaft to align with the mark on the crank sprocket.
Install the belt, rotate the crank 2 revolutions clockwise by hand bringing #1 back to TDC with the flywheel mark at 0 and recheck mark alignment and belt tension.
Repeat until correct.

Start the car. warm to operating temp, with engine running disconnect the CTS connector (power loss lamp illuminates, cooling fan cycles on), check/set ignition timing, shut engine off and then reconnect CTS.







 
#29 ·
I followed Jan's (NAJ) advice and troubleshooting guidelines because I had a similar problem.
It was a weak pump and a bad ASD relay in the power module.
Follow his steps and you'll fix the problem.
 
#31 ·
Me too! Haha

Well did some more work on the Omni and had good results everything seems to be better lined up.

I was unable to get the car to operating temperature do to fact that life is continuing to happen around me...

I still have to hook up all the accessories and apparently replace the fan and radiator due to a leak and the fan bearing being its final annoying loud leg. (I should have a spare around somewhere)

Hopefully I'll get back to it this week sometime and will have good results! Fingers crossed!
 
#32 ·
ALLLLLLLLLLLRIGHT ALREADY!!!

Something positive needs to happen soon during this GLH build... So i leak checked my radiator and everything was good. Then I replaced the fan because its bearing is toast. All was going smoothly until I went to re-install the alternator and the belt....

The freaking "tensioner" bolt setup stripped out. The removable clip on the alternator bracket stripped out and KO'd the bolt too. Does anyone know where I can find this clip thing? My idea is to weld a nut to the back of the alternator bracket and get a new bolt to use. Are there any better ideas floating around out there?
 
#34 ·
Well I'm back... not that any of you knew that I was gone but I have a fairly good excuse for not working on the GLH. My wife and I took 6 months off work and literally traveled around the world. But I'm back and settled into working and making money to fund this disease called a hobby.

When I left off I had it running-ish and stripped the alternator tensioner. I replaced that and put it all back together to find out something was still amiss. I tore it back down and checked everything for the 100th time and noticed something I'm a little embarrassed to admit.

In the picture from "the book" NAJ posted I only paid attention to the DOT on the cam, the DOT on the crank, and the DOT on the intermediate shaft.... I never paid attention to the two arrows on either side of the cam sprocket that should point to the seam in the head. Well once I noted the obvious advise. It ran really well and stayed running long enough for me to hit it with the timing light. I got it dialed in so that the Line With The Dot is hitting at 0 with the CTS unplugged.

Hopefully I have this part of it figured out. Ill be re-reading a couple things on here to double check my work for next week when I get to work on the car again. Thanks to everyone for helping me this far. We might just get this lil' car all sorted out after all!!!

D. Schick
 
#40 ·
Thanks I figured it out and THINK I have all my vacuum lines hooked back up. I began tidying up all the wiring and vacuum lines and it's starting to look better. I got all the accessories hooked back up and belts tightened down.

BUUUUT

When I went to start it a relay clicks and nothing. I noticed when I turn the keep to "run" the BRAKE idiot light illuminates. The relay that clicks is the starter relay.

I did some hunting and the only questionable thing I could find was one of the white 3 pronged pigtails to the distributor was looking pretty warn where the wires go into the plug. Thinking about cutting both pigtails off and making a weather-pak style plug on both ends.

Good idea or not?

Thanks for the help!
DJ

Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
 
#41 ·
Clicks when turning key to the start position...

First...
1)Is the battery fully charged (12.60 volts) and will it hold a load?
(If not sure take it to AZ and have it charged and tested)
2)Are both cables/battery posts clean (inside and outside) and tight on both ends.
If Yes to both 1 and 2...
Then you can check/test the starter relay and wiring.
3)The Starter Relay has two 12 volt power feeds, ground and power output to the starter solenoid.
Red - 12 Volt Battery Supply through Fusible Link.
Yellow - 12 Volts From Ignition Switch (Will only be powered with the key in the "start" position)
Brown/Yellow - Ground (Bolted to transaxle on MT, through Neutral Saftey Switch on AT)
Brown - 12 Volt Output to Starter Solenoid.
4)If you have 12 volts on the RD and YL wires, continuity to ground on the BN/YL wire (less than 5 ohms) and do not have 12 volts on the BN output wire replace the relay.
5)If you have 12 volts on the RD and YL wires, continuity to ground on the BN/YL wire and 12 volts on the BN wire the relay is good, check power to the starter on the + battery cable and solenoid wire at the starter.
If you have proper power at the starter and the wires/cables are clean/tight replace the starter.
 
#46 ·
I got it running again and now it's surging. On first attempt to startup when cold it revs to around 900rpm then dies. 2nd attempt same thing. 3rd attempt it revs then drops to like 100rpm but keeps itself alive.

Once running it surges between 200 and 1000 rpm.

I am almost certain I have the timing correct. I lined those bad boys up.

What should I check next?


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#47 ·
I am almost certain I have the timing correct. I lined those bad boys up.



Sent from my Moto G (4) using Tapatalk
If Cam and Ignition Timing have both been verified correct then your next steps in order would be...
1)Fault Codes
2)Vacuum Leaks/Map Sensor Calibration/Pressure
3)Fuel Pressure
4)Controller Ground Circuits

CAM AND IGNITION TIMING
http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f14/359212-cam-timing-belt-tension-84-95-a.html

MAP SENSOR CALIBRATION/PRESSURE
http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f14/344296-code-13-diagnostics.html

FUEL PRESSURE
http://www.turbododge.com/forums/f4/f14/358339-checking-fuel-pressure-84-93-turbo.html

Text Diagram Circuit component Line Design


Diagram Plan Floor plan Parallel
 
#49 ·
Here is the only vacuum line I can find that's open. It's under the throttle body. The first picture is of the entire area the second is of the vacuum line coming off of the part. I'm not sure where that is suppose to go. It seems like some kind of check valve or something.


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#51 ·
How does this coil spark look? Just curious if it could be part of my problem. Because when I look at my timing marks with the light the timing mark is inconsistent. It'll be there two times then gone the third or seems to hit every other time.

Here's a video of the spark from the coil. It's jumping a gap set at 25.

Link to the video below

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1gELu93553xfRV_TRNiZ8Tqh7TUIL1-0A/view?usp=drivesdk

Thanks

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#52 ·
I am unable to watch the video.

If you are using an adjustable spark tester set to 25 KV and the spark is blue and jumping the gap with no issue at all 4 plugs the ignition system is OK.

There is no way to check/test spark plugs other than a scope or physical inspection.

As far as ignition timing you need to disconnect the CTS with the engine running to get timing to base to view the timing mark.

If the mark is jumping around while at base timing and the ignition system checks OK either the timing belt is loose or there is something loose in the distributor.
 
#53 ·
I read your other post about how to tension the belt and my belt is constantly on the outside edge. I'll loosen the belt and it'll hardly move inward. The only time it moved the belt was so loose I could twist it more than half way around.

I'll be at the shop tomorrow. I'll try to get a video of the timing marks, spark test, and the belt tension. Hopefully I can figure out how to post the videos.

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#54 ·
I would not be to concerned about where the belt is riding on the sprocket at this time.
As long as you are sure the Cam and Ignition Timing are correct move on to the next steps in the diagnostics process unless of course the original issue has been resolved.
 
#56 ·
And if the oval slot in the cam sprocket is at the correct position with the cylinder head (12 o'clock center with the cylinder head) and the mark on the flywheel is at 0 then you are good.

Text Line art Illustration


Diagram Drawing Technical drawing Parallel
 
#57 ·
I worked on the Omni again over that past two days and I have the timing correct FINALLY. I believe all the marks line up, I may be a tooth off on the intermediate shaft still. I am still having a problem with starting the car. On a dead cold start (29*) it takes three tries to get the car to start and run. The first try it just turns over, try two it'll turn over crank and immediately die, try three it'll fire right up and idle.

The reason I think the intermediate shaft is still off a tooth is because of the starting problem and the fact that I have the distributor turned counter clockwise until its hitting the housing. This being said the timing marks when running look good.

I start the car and let it warm up. Then I disconnect the sensor to put into "Limp home mode". Then I hit it with the timing light. The mark comes up between 11 and 12. The I shut the car off plug the sensor back in and turn it back on. Sometimes it takes 3 tries as stated above. Once the car is running it stays on until I shut it off. (Which is an improvement)

Now for the bad... While I was still tinkering on the car I went to start it again and I didn't hear the fuel pump prime. I try to start it and it'll turn over but won't run. So I try a few more times and still won't start. I got my jumper wire as written by NAJ many times and manually actuated the ASD relay. It will usually click when I ground the circuit but there was no clicking. I checked for power to the coil and fuel pump but there was none.

Correct me if I'm wrong but in cars of this year the ASD relay is incorporated into either the Logic Module or Power Module in the engine bay of these cars? And if it's kaput do I have to replace the whole module?

Thanks to anyone that reads my rant and can point me in the right direction.
 
#60 ·
The reason I think the intermediate shaft is still off a tooth is because of the starting problem and the fact that I have the distributor turned counter clockwise until its hitting the housing. This being said the timing marks when running look good.

I start the car and let it warm up. Then I disconnect the sensor to put into "Limp home mode". Then I hit it with the timing light. The mark comes up between 11 and 12. The I shut the car off plug the sensor back in and turn it back on. Sometimes it takes 3 tries as stated above. Once the car is running it stays on until I shut it off. (Which is an improvement)
The intermediate shaft could be 5 tooth off, as long as you can get the ignition timing at 12 degree, it doesn't matter where the shaft is.
 
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