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1984 Daytona. AF/S
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I've been on a lot of forums during the past 20 years, and This one sure has a lot of good history and information. I've been wanting to run stock for years. It's a class that still rewards performance and enginunity. I've run Competition Eliminator, and Super Stock and I now have a Top Dragster. But Stock has been calling my name for years.
So to the chagrin of my wife and neighbors, I have hauled home a 1984 Dodge Daytona Turbo. This car set in a yard for almost 20 years and had a leaky window so water in the flood boards has made some rust.
Does anyone know where I can find floorboards?
I am spinning up a few wide-lobe sep cam cores for this, lift is limited to .445. I am going to put shims in the lifters to make them solid.
I am looking for a few 8-bolt cranks and common blocks. I will bore the blocks close to the max that's legal in Stock. 080 so a block with a lot of wear is great.



I helped build one of these last summer
 
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Greg,
I think with some sonic testing your gonna find the blocks will not accept anywhere near .080 overbore. Not sure if you can run this block but the 86-88 Tall Deck block will have the most meat in the cylinders. I put together one with a .050 overbore and after sonic checking it had almost as much meat in cylinders as a std. bore CB block! The TD block has +.470 taller deck, so I don't know if that is allowed or not for your class.
On T-M forum there was a thread on the block differences. Biggest thing you need to watch out for with big overbores is core shift. Knocking core plugs out of front and back will reveal how much core shift there is. Also looking in the water pump hole will reveal how much core shift you're dealing with. Below is link to some threads on T-M you might find some interest in.

Maserati block..Whats different?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks for that information. Unfortunately the rod length is set in stone as is the compression height of piston. I have a sonic checker so I will look. I might also concrete the block 2/3 up. Not sure the power level. I have a dyno so this motor is going to get beat on hard this winter. The turbo rule have changed recently and the only rule is the bore of inducer and wheel diameter at bore. It’s 2 mm bigger that stock. Basically you can run any turbo as long as that dimension is correct I think it 1.7060

I will give back as much information as I can, and I truly appreciate you alls help.

next I’m on to the transmission. Going with a automatic for consistency
 
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Got with you now Greg, and that sure looks like a Turbo, ok, we are nowhere near each other, these guys know what they are talking about, no doubt in my mind whatsoever, been lurking he a few years at the very least...I last ran this car in Spring of 97' at Phoenix, nearly bone Stock never machined until now, it sat in my garage the last 25 yrs., but now it is getting a treatment. Will be 20 thou over this 1st rebuild. But the right rotators, blueprinted, balanced, head was finally cut, when you get a .445/.445 you think is right, buy 2 please, I want 1. As is A great member here recently sold me a custom ground Reed Cam I just measured up in my TurboDodgeParts reworked head, .432 I/ .444 E 107 CL, 7 degrees adv. HAS A REALLY funky lobe with a ton of overlap and duration, he once set first the mph record in AF/S with, then both ends, he (Mr. Shull is out of Detroit, MI area. (Also sold me a Lunati, but that was over like around .520 intake and exhaust, measuring it exceeded .480 on both I/E lobes and was bumping up against my new valve stem seals, and still never got around the lobes fully going either direction, still had a quarter inch of each lobe untainted by the assembly Lube, so it far exceeded our .445/.445 max lift.

I have already told him that 1 I will probably list for sale here, and am still super thrilled with the purchase. That Reed cam is all he told me it was, and Reed was a killer cam grinder until he passed away in a plane crash sadly.

I think to get the kind of overlap this cam had, he got as close to max allowed Exhaust lift as he could safely go .444, then worked on duration and overlap, to get both valves opened at the same time at the right time (and they do, for a long time, then that exhaust slams shut fast as it falls off a cliff, that I think limited the max lift to lower on the intake, but...I have a lot more lift than my prior stock junk, and finally a real competition valve job cut, the PT shimmed lifters, decent springs, and that cam, it is a breather now for sure once my pistons are delivered this month and short block is finished.

Yeah, I figured you had a 146HP Turbo edition 84' when I saw AF/S on your tag, rare indeed. I am the only one so far that has ever run in Stock Elim. The 84' 2.2L TBI upright Bosch Single Point TBI, and was hoping to stay that way, but we can share info all the same spread this far apart, 99HP/146HP...AF/S to EF/S. And at least they released your ECU data, and pre-written cals are available for yours hopefully.

The EPAlocked up the 84' model year code (the 85's were cracked and with a legacy cable for the underhood diagnostic port,, I have yet to buy from someone here, I have read the tables on the 85, so I think we will eventually now, change that which I need to be able to change by just changing the function tables keys, instead of attempting to continue to trick the ECU, and power module into giving up the functions, and allow it to actually be an EFI car again....at least I hope so, and about a month from finding out now.

Back in 95' was on the tour all nats/div events, drove the car all over the country, loaded with gear, not trailered, running it in Stock, not competitive for the category, but competitive in class. That was in GF/SA 275 lbs heavier than now, same Index, same 25.00 lbs/HP. My super slow sled gonna fly, but Stan in the Aeries just Bombed the record in June 16.18 at 80.32, I used to run over 84, we shall see about that ET record though, penalties come with running that far under. I am not putting that weight back in that car ever again. HVAC deleted, Windshield wipers deleted, fuel tank deleted, 5 gal fuel cell and bulkhead added in spare tire well, exhaust except Header deleted, radio lights up but is 1" deep, Power Steering deleted, Water pump now Moroso motor powered, only belts on crank, Alt. And cam/Int. Shaft, hall effect distro. (Acts only as a cam synch, as earlier 83 Dodge Omni Elect. Spark control module with the Omni harness hall effect cable end added delivers the spark. So out of the power module control, I set timing it stays set.

ECU tricked using the head water temp sensor and a potentiometer, to dial base rich lean map, then ECU uses that base, map sensor, tps, and the O2 to fine tune it (Stock Elim. I SET ONCE, based on relative altitude richer at sea level, leaner at altitude, to just get car more consistent, and repeatable, but if ET Bracket racing, set round by round, cool richer, as heat of day, leaner, as goes into evening and cool nights, richer a bit per round, makes it highly repeatable).

Ok Greg, what part of the country are you from?....I am in N.W., AZ (100 Miles from Las Vegas, NV)

GrandpaSleeper you are not Stan K. with the 83' Aeries Wagon and live in Nebraska are you brother? I assumed the Maple Leaf meant you lived in Canada eh?

But, I have certainly been wrong by assuming anything at this point in my life....old, just not older than dirt or old in mind.... yet.
 

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Thanks for that information. Unfortunately the rod length is set in stone as is the compression height of piston. I have a sonic checker so I will look. I might also concrete the block 2/3 up. Not sure the power level. I have a dyno so this motor is going to get beat on hard this winter. The turbo rule have changed recently and the only rule is the bore of inducer and wheel diameter at bore. It’s 2 mm bigger that stock. Basically you can run any turbo as long as that dimension is correct I think it 1.7060

I will give back as much information as I can, and I truly appreciate you alls help.

next I’m on to the transmission. Going with a automatic for consistency
We will be a lot different here, as I can hook in a snowstorm with only 99 HP, but I Am set with a really low 1st and second gear very customized twaked gearsets, plus the DC shift kit in a reworked but not reversed valve body, a choice of a set of very old but very useful 20" tall X 14" X 6" MT E.T. FWD Slicks (They do not even make them under 25" tall now), that lower the gear ratio a ton more if in class racing, or P185/75 R14 Street tires if I really want to play games with the A/S, A/SA, B/S, B/SA fast boys and girls and take real advantage and stretch out the rollout game of making a really long wait at the tree for them even longer....lol.

What transaxle is in it? Equal length halfshafts I am sure. What first and second ratios in it now? Turbo Action made me a killer converter, static foot breaking 3,800 stalling flashes 4,200 (real flash though actual 5 mph rolling stab to the floor 4,400 RPM), and hooks up. You would light those tires up at that or stand it on that rear bumper if you hooked up fully. (LOL, can't beat physics....Next up, chassis tightening as has too much rear squat, nose rise leaving at those rpm's, leaving with mine easy, getting out the back door not on the Rev limit feature in the unreleased coded ECU was always tough. I Had issues now resolved, the solenoids for the fuel tank/charcoal cannister fuel vapor purge system, leave the sol's on the car plugged in and active, remove the cannister, all hoses for that system (off road use only), cap off all ports securely to them, as the purge system only operates during full throttle operation, and you would get my former vacuum leak at full throttle pop, pop...that acts just like both an ECU Rev limit feature (when it's not....I have an 84' TBI collection of the rebuilt ECU's, as all are rebuilt units, and each rebuilder sets the Rev limit feature at a different rpm strangely for streetable safety), or almost like a knock sensor issue, but all along it was 2 things, that charcoal cannister fuel tank vapor system would trigger, only at full throttle under full load, and there was an open port on the cannister causing a leak.

Problem or issue #2 you will not have was the plastic PCV baffle box in the stamped steel valve cover splitting on a seam causing the same vacuum leak under full power (you already have a Turbo valve cover, and I bought 1, Chrysler TURBO on mine is being milled to simply read Chrysler T. B. I. The T is staying, U milled off, R welded and milled into a B, B milled off O milling off everything but the left leg into an I. That resolves the pcv baffle issue, and that valve cover has an alum. baffle already in it, added a pcv between the valve cover and the throttle body.

Next up, injectors are treated just like carb jets, you can run any size injector that fits the stock location don't even look at or breath on the seat, and no extras beyond stock but like read the carb Stock rules, as injected cars boosted or not, are treated as carbed since no special injector rules exist,, do not change the seats they sit in, increase any air bleeds that are not strictly called out in the carb. rules, same with throttle blades or bore, spacers, etc, therfore be very careful what you do there, pressure regulators are changeable, pulses, variable, and now computerized cars (Since The addition of Factory Stock Showdown additions, can use a computerized shifting internal valve body, shifts by time or rpm, your choice....And Turbo Action makes one already for your combo, working on mine now). Would be super nice to put in D and forget it after setting the dials.

Especially when looking over your rear shoulder out of the fishbowl an 84 Daytona is for the second 1/8th mile, while faster cars are attempting to reel you in, and cutting them down to the last inch of 1,320' real estate.

I have more, and no doubt so do you. Pro Comp, Super Stock, and Stock are a lot alike, trying to squeeze honey out of a turnip, every ounce of legal horsepower counts, every millisecond counts in your in class races. You already know the game. You will love it.



It (the absolute best part of the car to date is the auto transaxle), outside of a fluid and filter change, done yesterday and painting of the plain steel pan, and the new mounts, is the only thing on the car not changing a bit, still hanging in the engine bay and I painted around it.

Let's share some info.

Gary Lucier
 

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I've been on a lot of forums during the past 20 years, and This one sure has a lot of good history and information. I've been wanting to run stock for years. It's a class that still rewards performance and enginunity. I've run Competition Eliminator, and Super Stock and I now have a Top Dragster. But Stock has been calling my name for years.
So to the chagrin of my wife and neighbors, I have hauled home a 1984 Dodge Daytona Turbo. This car set in a yard for almost 20 years and had a leaky window so water in the flood boards has made some rust.
Does anyone know where I can find floorboards?
I am spinning up a few wide-lobe sep cam cores for this, lift is limited to .445. I am going to put shims in the lifters to make them solid.
I am looking for a few 8-bolt cranks and common blocks. I will bore the blocks close to the max that's legal in Stock. 080 so a block with a lot of wear is great.



I helped build one of these last summer
Beautiful car!
 

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BTW, when you pull of that A/C, save the combo Alt.-A/C Bracket and the 4 rubber isolators. Will show you a pic of my custom combo 14 lb. Steel plate Wt. Box and engine torque strap. Box and max total lead shot bags is adj. up to 100 lbs. Total, mounted above the alternator in that same mount (above the front spindles up high, over the right drive tire, offsetting drivers weight, helps hooking, and mount bar goes to right front frame behind headlights, secured legally w/ 2- 1/2" bolts as required on a rubber isolator pad. Mounting arm is torque strap that keeps that 2.2L engine from torqueing to the rear at all. Same plane as the front center mount.

You may not like the idea, but you also may if you saw it work.
 

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Hey there, I have experience with the floorboards, as when I got my car they were completely gone. Your best bet is to remove the interior and cut and weld. I've noticed however on the Chrysler lasers I've seen, the floors are solid.. The one I have for parts has solid floors, and I saw one in a lot, and it had solid floors. (The one in the lot was extra space for a junkyard, I tried calling but I think it got crushed, God rest her soul).

If you can find one with a solid floor you could likely cut the floor out, or swap all the stuff from your car onto the donor car.

Those are your best options unless having welded metal for floors takes you out of the "stock" category.


Floors aside you've got a nice car, and those wheels are my favorite style (of course they're hard to find for an 85 car with 5 lug.) The turbo graphic is awesome.

I wish you the best of luck
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Wow. A lot of reading. All of the tuning issues and wiring are fixed. I have a box for all 30 lbs of it going in storage. The Holley HP ecm takes its place. It will control the wastegate as well. I’ll help any that want to do the Ecm deal. The HP version is a little over kill but it’s on NHRAs accepted list. The Terminator ECM is dramatically less expensive and will handle any thing you could need. Welding floor boards in is allowed in stock.
what’s the deal with the wheels. I get a lot of people asking about them.
As to the weight box. I’m having to put the car on a serious diet. Need to find 300 lbs to get to bottom of A. 13 lbs per hp Plus 170 standard driver. The motor is rated at 160 hp.
So 2250 with me in it. At end of run. Stock allows you to get rid of AC , heater. Wiring. Exhaust. Carpet padding. All of the under hood extra stuff. It must have thin carpet. Two racing seats and dash.
got a Pyle of parts if anyone needs them.
 

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The 1984 only, 15" 4 bolt alloy wheels are scarce and fit many other cars.

Daytona, Laser, Omni, Rampage, Caravan Neon and many other with 4 bolt.

Later cars went to 5 bolt and are very common and interchangeable.

The 5 bolt opened up several upgraded brake packages as well.

Thanks
Randy
 
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
how hard is it to convert to a 5 lug spindle?
 

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Not hard at all.

All axle outer splines are the same 1984-1995.

For the front you need OEM style 5 stud wheel bearings and hub. EG: MOOG 518501

For the rear you need 5 stud brake drums with wheel bearing and hub.

The rear drums need to be same diameter as what you have.

From memory there were 200 and 220 mm rear brake drums.

Yours is probably the larger 220?? mm rear drum ??.

Probably have to get rear hubs used, most any 1985-1990 car fits.

All other parts are available new and very inexpensive. EG:Rockauto

Some later model drear discs fit but I'm assuming you want light.

Some K cars had the smaller 5 bolt rear drums. EG: RAYBESTOS 2913R

What diameter ever drum you use it must match it's matching backing plate.

To go to the lighter 200 mm rear get the matching parts from a donor.

Backing plate and hub will need to be used, all else is available new.

Any G body experts feel free to correct or contradict any of the above.

I'm going from memory and it's old and stroke ridden.

We like to give accurate info !!

Thanks
Randy
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Does anyone need the parts I'm
pulling off this car
 

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Hey there, I have experience with the floorboards, as when I got my car they were completely gone. Your best bet is to remove the interior and cut and weld. I've noticed however on the Chrysler lasers I've seen, the floors are solid.. The one I have for parts has solid floors, and I saw one in a lot, and it had solid floors. (The one in the lot was extra space for a junkyard, I tried calling but I think it got crushed, God rest her soul).

If you can find one with a solid floor you could likely cut the floor out, or swap all the stuff from your car onto the donor car.

Those are your best options unless having welded metal for floors takes you out of the "stock" category.


Floors aside you've got a nice car, and those wheels are my favorite style (of course they're hard to find for an 85 car with 5 lug.) The turbo graphic is awesome.

I wish you the best of luck
The Swiss cheese wheels are easier to find in 5 lug as are the pizza (fewer holes), harder to find in 4 lug 15".

The hub switchover to 5 lug is easy, and cheap, about 35 bucks a hub bearing set, and will be needed once you pour that money into the block and start making horsepower.

I have the hubs in storage here on the shelf and have yet to collect the 5 lug brakes and related hardware, as all my existing wheels and tires are 4 lug 100mm bolt circle, and the 20" tall X14" X 6" M.T. ET FWD Slicks I have fit my existing heavy stock wheels.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I'm about to remove the AC and Heater core and other under-dash non-essential parts . Any tips , does the complete dash need to come out, or is there a trick
 

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The Swiss cheese wheels are easier to find in 5 lug as are the pizza (fewer holes), harder to find in 4 lug 15".

The hub switchover to 5 lug is easy, and cheap, about 35 bucks a hub bearing set, and will be needed once you pour that money into the block and start making horsepower.

I have the hubs in storage here on the shelf and have yet to collect the 5 lug brakes and related hardware, as all my existing wheels and tires are 4 lug 100mm bolt circle, and the 20" tall X14" X 6" M.T. ET FWD Slicks I have fit my existing heavy stock wheels.
I've got the Pizza wheels with fewer holes, 5 lug.
 

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Does anyone need the parts I'm
pulling off this car
Yes please, those wheels I would love to buy if you do the 4 lug to 5 lug switch for my 4 lug 84' Daytona EF/S Stock Elim car, and would also be interested in the other 4 lug stuff you remove as backup parts if they are not worn out, cleanable, and printable and not bent up in any real fashion.

Mine of course is an 84 TBI 2.2L, so any direct Turbo related stuff others could use more. Holler at me please as you remove and replace up ok Greg, thanks.
Wow. A lot of reading. All of the tuning issues and wiring are fixed. I have a box for all 30 lbs of it going in storage. The Holley HP ecm takes its place. It will control the wastegate as well. I’ll help any that want to do the Ecm deal. The HP version is a little over kill but it’s on NHRAs accepted list. The Terminator ECM is dramatically less expensive and will handle any thing you could need. Welding floor boards in is allowed in stock.
what’s the deal with the wheels. I get a lot of people asking about them.
As to the weight box. I’m having to put the car on a serious diet. Need to find 300 lbs to get to bottom of A. 13 lbs per hp Plus 170 standard driver. The motor is rated at 160 hp.
So 2250 with me in it. At end of run. Stock allows you to get rid of AC , heater. Wiring. Exhaust. Carpet padding. All of the under hood extra stuff. It must have thin carpet. Two racing seats and dash.
got a Pyle of parts if anyone needs them.
I can help with that diet my brother, I just dieted mine legally 275 lbs exactly. Start by removing that HVAC box under dash, take out the dash tower first, then the whole box removes from the firewall side and from behind the removed glove box, that will go back in later.

Then remove the attaching hardware under the dash, but leave in the dash controls (required), and that huge HVAC box slides right out the passenger door giving you much front seat legroom.

Next up, from engine bay, hood off, watch out the hood weighs a ton, 3 people removal is best, mine weighs 275 lbs, but cannot change that danger. Take out all wiper related hardware, leave the switch in dash and I made blocker plates up to cover the holes (I have extras cut will give em to you if you wish, to bend, mount, paint up). And when I bought the trim buttons, I bought the bulk type kits as I could get 600 of em in different types and sizes in carry cases, for the same price as 5 oem of 1 type so I can supply you with all brand new trim buttons in same type, can even grind the edges on the backer plates, and bend so they just need to be painted and pressed in to fit, want to trade some parts for parts as you go along? Just trying to save you some time on dieting (the hardest part to stay legal with, reading, rereading the rules daily has taken a lot of time, removing wt once that is done rudimentary, except what goes back on.

Next up, I went to the rear (as 90 percent of weight legally removed to reach my 275 lb goal was removed from drivers side of firewall, to drivers side of rear bumper, 5 percent from engine bay- full AC Heater hose delete), was covering the only part of a silver/silver w/ smoke gray car originally, outside has been painted twice, first candy metallic blue, then the 3 tone all red over blue w/white stripe (all 3 colors are dupont, a certain combo a Dodge project car was only sold in). The engine bay was still silver, and chose to paint it and wiper area in Duplicolor Sandable primer, then added a lil wt to the engine bay using Duplicolor Gloss Black Caliper spray can enamel with ceramic for hardness and durability underhood and in wipers area, to last, and masked off wiring and transaxle that I did not drop out.

So, used to race it in GF/SA, 110 HP @25 lbs per HP 2,763 lbs plus 170 driver wt. And with at least 10 gal. Of VP C-12, next up, dropped tank, straps, pump, sender, switched in a full bulkhead upper, and lower cover over a 5 gal Jegs poly fuel cell mounted in the spare tire well with the sump out the bottom. Pics attached, a Jegs EFI fuel system (filters pre & post, pump that would run your combo, as I want adj. volume and pressures up to 70 PSI w/ my TBI return system. Added a roll of 3/8th steel line to tie it all in to original steel del. and returns. See the pics below., the old A/C condenser I had in 94 converted at a Rad shop to the Transaxle cooler, took it out, and that may go back in if it scales right, dunno yet, that adds 3.5-4 qts of ATF, always ran nice and cool, but that is a lot heavier than like a log double pass cooler. With it out though I removed my goal, after removing 2 rear speakers, cutting the radio down to about 2" deep, light in it still works, tuning needle works by knob, radio is just a fake front mounting, dash looks perfectly right, all controls still there and legal (Still have plenty to remove if necessary once it is scaled with engine back in (visors, 3 speakers in the dash 1 LG, 2 small, still upper HVAC ducting I can remove, all lower ducting out, both front and rear seats unchanged, but if you go lighter in drivers seat, legally both fronts must match, rears are heavy seats, only way to legally remove them is to put a rollback or cage in, not a dieting factor though net, may stiffen the car, but could end up net wt. Heavier. Right side mirror can be removed, but must then install a nice triangle of blocker plate to fill and trim it out. Antenna I had originally switched to a unscrewable shirt stub type, can easily delete that now fill with a chrome push in round chromed blocker scushion button, not yet done till I scale completed car. Fuel cell was a lot of work and expense, but highly worth it, only exhaust now is the removed hooker ram charger header rewrapped for heat reduction, moved 1 of the support hangers. That former Midas piping and muffler from collector to beyond rear bumper weighed a lot, cut it at rear axle and it is in the diet pile, Will get a quick round Borla, switch the 3 bolt cone off the old piping, have welded to the Borla so if I need a muffler at any track, though always passed the sound meter test uncorked, I will have it. Dedicated race car now, but still streetable if need be with a couple easy additions.

Other than the interior changes, all heater hoses, valves underhood gone, power steering deleted, and converted using what you see as a simple hose resiviour to add pS fluid to, really still steers easy, Water pump switched off the crank to a not so simple to fab up Moroso electric motor, and belt setup it took a while to fit perfectly, and get right sized belts for both that and the Alternator, but now I have all numbers and suppliers to share.

Only things still robbing HP on crank are Cam, and Intermediate shaft (Oil pump and Distro.).

I have all patterns, supplier for metals, and cutting if you want here locally, right priced if you want to do any of the above faster than I achieved the diet. Can give or trade a lot with you if you want.

When I went to get the metals and have them plasma cut, I asked them to do my upper fuel cell bulkhead- covers the cell in the spare tire/rear hatch area, friend powder coated it red to match my upper, and the protection box lower blue.

I bought 1 sheet, needed the bulkhead, a lower ring for fill access, upper manhole for fill access easy quick remove fill manhole, then seal is done using an old truck tire tube...I still have plenty of the gasket material to share.

Anyway, I had the upper bulkhead and all the wiper area blocker plate patterns in cardboard and the spare tire well area board (with extra materials taped on to perfectly fill the indent area), and last thing he asked was to list the number of templates I had, 8...and he cut 8 of each of the wiper area plate sets instead of 1, so I have a number of sets left, would like to gift them to you, I can grind the edges, bend and drill em tomorrow, and send them to you with all push in new trim buttons needed, you will use the 2 removed nuts when pulling out the main wiper motor and arms, and the only 2 pc set of pcs I do not have extras of are the 2 that cover the wiper arm holes but can cut them out of another blank with tin snips

You pay the shipping, and a full set is yours my gift for first delete of the diet mission Greg. Can ship out middle to end of the week, and my son runs a pack and ship here in N. W. Arizona so my family discount is cheaper.
 

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I'm about to remove the AC and Heater core and other under-dash non-essential parts . Any tips , does the complete dash need to come out, or is there a trick
Nope, comes right out without removing the dash, hold on a second, sending pics, glove box does need removal, and tough to get back in those rear bumpers, but give me 10 mins, sending pics as I removed the HVAC box, and covered holes, we should get on the phone, could talk you through it beginning to end.

1(928)377-8581 Gary
 
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