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Discussion Starter #1
My laser wont start again(this is the 3rd time) it does the same thing every time but before i explain that .... i did a tune up on it,changed plugs,wires,button,cap & put new belts on it but now it wont start.I checked firing order its good so i figured i would try the key shuffle code thing and codes 12,24,26,27,32 & 54 came up so i disconnected the battery & PM waited about 15 mins connected it all back up did the key shuffle code thing again and i got codes 12,24,26,54 could the PM be bad ?
 

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My laser wont start again(this is the 3rd time) it does the same thing every time but before i explain that .... i did a tune up on it,changed plugs,wires,button,cap & put new belts on it but now it wont start.I checked firing order its good so i figured i would try the key shuffle code thing and codes 12,24,26,27,32 & 54 came up so i disconnected the battery & PM waited about 15 mins connected it all back up did the key shuffle code thing again and i got codes 12,24,26,54 could the PM be bad ?
I would be more inclined to believe you have a bad ground on the intake manifold. Multiple sensor faults usually means a bad ground...

You didn't mention changing the HEP in the distributor, that may be at fault as well...
 

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You got these fault codes w/o trying to crank the engine? Typically the fault codes will appear after a crank attempt, if no cranking had occurred and these codes were p[resent I would also be inclined to instruct you to look for a missing ground.

12 is normal to see if the battery was recently disconnected and the engine not run to full operating temp (maybe a few times).

What year car is it we are working on? There is a difference in some of the code meanings depending on the year, especially 84 & 85.
 

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Discussion Starter #4 (Edited)
I did crank the engine before i got the codes.Its a 85 laser,The car did start prior to the tune up but after i installed everything it didnt start.I pretty sure the code 54 is the Hall Effect, but the others im guessing theres something wrong with my injecters ?My brother says that the Pm is bad.
 

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95% of the time that a new problem occurs after work was done it is related to the work that was done.

IMO start with the lowest code number (TPS Code 24) and go from there.
 

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Discussion Starter #6
Well before i did the tune up it did the same thing.It would crank but not start,this is the third time its done that plus im not really understanding the code,i know they narrow it down but they still dont understand them.
 

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May I suggest that you pull the vacuum line off the fuel pressure regulator and see if there is any fuel in the line. When A FPR leaks past the diaphragm, it leaks into the intake and then dribbles down into a cylinder and floods the engine with fuel, it won't start till the gas leaks past the rings. On our cars, you can clear the flood by trying to crank the engine with the gas pedal all the way to the floor. At wide open throttle (WOT) the computer shuts off the injectors till you release the gas pedal, its the clear flood programming.

You can also leave the line disconnected and turn the key to on, this should pressurize the fuel rail, and when you shut it off, there should never been any fuel coming out of the vacuum fitting for the FPR.

I have had two cars with a no start condition, let them sit for several hours and they crank right up. But if you flood one well enough, the plugs will be fuel fouled and it will NEVER start till you replace them. I discovered this once when I did a head gasket. After doing the gasket, I just pulled the coil wire and cranked the engine till I had oil pressure. The HEP was still plugged in so the computer just kept firing the injectors and it got flooded. Took me all day to figure out why the heck I had spark and fuel but it would not start...or even act like it was trying to start.

Just a thought...
 

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Orange/White (OR/WT) Wire = 5 Volt Reference
Orange/Dark Blue (OR/DB) Wire = TPS Signal
Black/Light Blue (BK/LB) Wire = Signal Return

1)Locate the 6 wire AIS/TPS connector near the throttle body.
2)With the digital voltmeter set on a 12 or 20 volt dc scale probe the OR/WT wire (#1 in the pic) with the + lead and the - lead connected to a good ground (battery - cable)
You should read 5 volts.
If voltage does not read at least 4.90 volts post back.
If OK continue...
3)With the digital voltmeter set on a 12 or 20 volt dc scale probe the OR/WT wire with the + voltmeter lead and the BK/LB wire (#3 in the picture) with the - voltmeter lead.
You should read 5 volts as in step #2.
If you do not read at least 4.90 volts post back.
If OK continue...
4)With the digital voltmeter set on a 12 or 20 volt dc scale probe the OR/DB wire (#2 in the picture) with the + voltmeter lead and the BK/LB wire (#3 in the picture) with the - voltmeter lead.
Voltage at closed throttle should read between .30 and .90 volts.

ELECTRIC-TPS Connector 85-86.jpg
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Orange/White (OR/WT) Wire = 5 Volt Reference
Orange/Dark Blue (OR/DB) Wire = TPS Signal
Black/Light Blue (BK/LB) Wire = Signal Return

1)Locate the 6 wire AIS/TPS connector near the throttle body.
2)With the digital voltmeter set on a 12 or 20 volt dc scale probe the OR/WT wire (#1 in the pic) with the + lead and the - lead connected to a good ground (battery - cable)
You should read 5 volts.
If voltage does not read at least 4.90 volts post back.
If OK continue...
3)With the digital voltmeter set on a 12 or 20 volt dc scale probe the OR/WT wire with the + voltmeter lead and the BK/LB wire (#3 in the picture) with the - voltmeter lead.
You should read 5 volts as in step #2.
If you do not read at least 4.90 volts post back.
If OK continue...
4)With the digital voltmeter set on a 12 or 20 volt dc scale probe the OR/DB wire (#2 in the picture) with the + voltmeter lead and the BK/LB wire (#3 in the picture) with the - voltmeter lead.
Voltage at closed throttle should read between .30 and .90 volts.

View attachment 233810

Ok i tried this and the first one was 5.42

the second one was 5.32

and the third one was 0.05

I probed the wires good too .
 

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Discussion Starter #12
May I suggest that you pull the vacuum line off the fuel pressure regulator and see if there is any fuel in the line. When A FPR leaks past the diaphragm, it leaks into the intake and then dribbles down into a cylinder and floods the engine with fuel, it won't start till the gas leaks past the rings. On our cars, you can clear the flood by trying to crank the engine with the gas pedal all the way to the floor. At wide open throttle (WOT) the computer shuts off the injectors till you release the gas pedal, its the clear flood programming.

You can also leave the line disconnected and turn the key to on, this should pressurize the fuel rail, and when you shut it off, there should never been any fuel coming out of the vacuum fitting for the FPR.

I have had two cars with a no start condition, let them sit for several hours and they crank right up. But if you flood one well enough, the plugs will be fuel fouled and it will NEVER start till you replace them. I discovered this once when I did a head gasket. After doing the gasket, I just pulled the coil wire and cranked the engine till I had oil pressure. The HEP was still plugged in so the computer just kept firing the injectors and it got flooded. Took me all day to figure out why the heck I had spark and fuel but it would not start...or even act like it was trying to start.

Just a thought...
I tried this too and no fuel came out of the vacuum line.But i did take the cap off the little nozzle and pressed down on the valve and no gas came out of it.I think that for testing gas pressure ?
 

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I tried this too and no fuel came out of the vacuum line.But i did take the cap off the little nozzle and pressed down on the valve and no gas came out of it.I think that for testing gas pressure ?
Yep. If you don't get any gas out of that, you don't have fuel pressure. When you first turn on the key, do you hear the fuel pump in the tank prime for a second? If not, I think you found your main issue... You will still need to deal with the sensor faults though.
 

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The no start diagnostics start with checking and repairing fault codes before moving on to basic ignition issues.

5.42 and 5.32 volts is high because the line is only a 5 volt reference, lets blame it on the meter not being accurate.
If you read .05 volts in step #4 while backprobing the OR/DB and BK/DB wires in the connector the TPS is shorted and that is why you set the TPS code.
While performing step #4 one more time slowly open the throttle, does voltage increase as the throttle is opened?

Still confused/makes no sense to me as to how after doing a basic tune up you now have all of these fault codes set that were not there before.
Code 12 - Battery Feed To Logic Module Recently Lost
(Is a real fault if you have not disconnected the battery recently)
Code 24 - TPS Voltage Low or High
Code 26 - Injector Circuit 1/2
Code 27 - Injector Circuit 3/4
Code 32 - Power Loss Lamp Circuit
Code 54 - Loss of Fuel Sync Signal

My 40 years of experience tells me something happened while you were working on the car.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
The no start diagnostics start with checking and repairing fault codes before moving on to basic ignition issues.

5.42 and 5.32 volts is high because the line is only a 5 volt reference, lets blame it on the meter not being accurate.
If you read .05 volts in step #4 while backprobing the OR/DB and BK/DB wires in the connector the TPS is shorted and that is why you set the TPS code.
While performing step #4 one more time slowly open the throttle, does voltage increase as the throttle is opened?

Still confused/makes no sense to me as to how after doing a basic tune up you now have all of these fault codes set that were not there before.
Code 12 - Battery Feed To Logic Module Recently Lost
(Is a real fault if you have not disconnected the battery recently)
Code 24 - TPS Voltage Low or High
Code 26 - Injector Circuit 1/2
Code 27 - Injector Circuit 3/4
Code 32 - Power Loss Lamp Circuit
Code 54 - Loss of Fuel Sync Signal

My 40 years of experience tells me something happened while you were working on the car.

step #4 I tested slowly open the throttle,the voltage does increase as the throttle is opened.I when ahead and changed the TPS and it does the same thing but with step# 4 the voltage is 1.23.This in not the only time this car has done this.The only thing i did was change the 2 belts,put plugs,wires,button & cap on it.I was carful to how i did that and didnt bump or smack into anything.I know this car sat for a couple years atleast without maintenance and i know someone beat it before they sold it with all the mud caked up on the underside some spots are 1/2 thick with mud.but all that aside the car is solid for a 85.But i am not a mechanic i do know afew things but that the extend of that.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
I also when and put the old plugs,wires,ect back on it and it does the same thing its doing now.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
ok i changed the TPS back the the original one when over the connections and now the only codes are 12,27 & 55 .I know not to worry about 12 & 55.
 
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