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Discussion Starter #1
I am trying to find out if there is any way to tune the completely stock 3.0L V6 (specifically in a manual '91 Daytona) without any kind of aftermarket parts. Like adjusting fuel pressure, timing, tricking sensors to "correct" for "bad" air/fuel ratios, etc. So far I've found nothing at all. Anyone have some advice for me? Just looking to see what can be improved on within the constraints of a stock engine, ECU, and fuel system.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I really want to keep the car as close to 100% original as I can because the car has loads of sentimental value. I really don't have the time, money or space to modify anything anyways, so just messing with stuff that can be adjusted is all I can do. Plus, apartment complexes don't exactly see old cars with open hoods as desirable...
 

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do a tune up with good plugs.
buy an extra plenum and port it.
look into larger throttle body.
take it to a muffler shop and have a nice muffler shop exhaust ran on it.
 

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I do not want you to waste time/money and become frustrated so here is my story...

My Son did absolutely everything to his 3.0L and the car ran slower, he went from 16.10 in the 1320' to running 16.80 in the 1320',
He like me was a Bracket Racer,his original goal was to get into the 15's so he could run two classes at Atco Raceway (Pro 15.99 cut and Street 12.00 and up)

After witnessing him spend hours and hours and tons of $$$ over a three year period for nothing but aggravation and frustration I am not a fan of "Attempting To Mod/Tune a 3.0L".

The mods were not done all at once, the exhaust was on there when he was running 16.10 and as he added mods such as the ported plenums he got slower, the more he did the slower he got.
He had the plenum and intake ported, added spacers, had the heads ported with a 3 angle valve cut and had the manifolds/spacers/gaskets port matched to the head, installed a 3.8L Mini Van TB, Cold Air Intake (real cold air, plumbed to the opening where removed fog lamps were), 3" Exhaust with Low Restriction Cat and Muffler (got ticketed twice for excessive noise) and work done on the A604 (shift kit, heavy duty clutches, final drive gears from a mini van, torque converter), installed a manual fan switch to keep the engine at a lower temp when racing (he experimented with different temps), installed a trans temp gauge, auxiliary trans cooler, etc and a Wideband O2 Sensor (the car was running about 11.5/1 @ WOT (You cannot install an Adjustable FPR without modifications to the Fuel Rail), Street Slicks and Air Bags in the rear to prevent squatting on launch which unloads the front wheels.
It made absolutely no difference if he shifted or let it shift on its own.

On a couple of occasions I verified the basics for him just to be sure they were correct...
Compression/Cylinder Leak Down, Fuel Pressure, Injector Flow, Map Sensor Response and Ignition Timing at all RPM/Load Conditions, wish my 2.2L was as sound as his 3.0L.

So, thats my 3.0L experience/story, take it for what it is worth.
Others will tell you that the 3.0L mods work to improve performance but you cannot prove it by me.

FYI..
Giving suggestions on what may or may not have been wrong with his setup is now a MOOT POINT since he sold the car a year ago with all types of additional parts for $500.00
 

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CoupleOvans
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final drive gears from a mini van

Right here is the cause of his car getting slower. The minivans ran longer ratios, which would have made the car slower no matter how much power he gained. If he wanted quicker he should have went with shorter ratios from something like a Neon. Once he installed the minivan final drive, any other mods were moot.
 

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final drive gears from a mini van

Right here is the cause of his car getting slower. The minivans ran longer ratios, which would have made the car slower no matter how much power he gained. If he wanted quicker he should have went with shorter ratios from something like a Neon. Once he installed the minivan final drive, any other mods were moot.
Actually that is not true.
He slowed down long before he changed the final drive gears, they and other trans mods were the last resort.
He only changed the gears to see if it made any difference.
He had the trans out and swapped in Final Drive Gears from a couple of different compatible cars to see what would happen and none including the OE Gears made a difference.

He had the trans apart so many times he was able to complete the entire procedure in only a couple of hours (including R+I the trans) and he also had technical help from a 30 Year Chrysler Transmission Tech (not me).

Until I actually see in person at the track a Chrysler 3.0L running quicker than 16.00 consistently even in 90 degree high humidity conditions without an added turbo/NOS/Manual Trans/Aftermarket Ignition/MegaSquirt, etc then I will continue to say it cannot be done.
 

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CoupleOvans
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Actually that is not true.
He slowed down long before he changed the final drive gears, they and other trans mods were the last resort.
He only changed the gears to see if it made any difference.
He had the trans out and swapped in Final Drive Gears from a couple of different compatible cars to see what would happen and none including the OE Gears made a difference.

He had the trans apart so many times he was able to complete the entire procedure in only a couple of hours (including R+I the trans) and he also had technical help from a 30 Year Chrysler Transmission Tech (not me).

Until I actually see in person at the track a Chrysler 3.0L running quicker than 16.00 consistently even in 90 degree high humidity conditions without an added turbo/NOS/Manual Trans/Aftermarket Ignition/MegaSquirt, etc then I will continue to say it cannot be done.
Chances are you won't see it. The mods improve power higher in the rpm range, at the expense of some low end torque. Once you move the power band up in the rpm range, the car becomes slower out of the hole, which combined with different gearing is why his car "got slower".

Remember 1/4 mile times are not the only way to tell how quick a car is, nor do they represent how it feels on the street.

Joe Sirianni already proved simple intake/exhaust mods can net impressive gains when he dyno'd his 1993 Shadow with Ported Plenum, 52MM TB, and full exhaust. He pulled 146 WHP/ 166 WTQ with 95+% of peak torque from 2200-4500 rpms. That equates to roughly 173hp/196ft-lbs at the crank, which is over 30 hp/20 ft-lbs more than stock from a few simple mods.
 

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Remember 1/4 mile times are not the only way to tell how quick a car is, nor do they represent how it feels on the street.
And all he was looking for was an increase in 1/4 mile ET, Nothing Else.

He wanted to run two classes at the track, Street and Pro.
Pro has a 15.99 cut so he needed to be able to run 15.99 under the worse conditions 90+ degrees with 80/90% humidity since he would not be able to dial higher than 15.99.

At the time the car was running 16.10 in good air conditions so we figured he would have to run 15.30 - 15.40 in good air conditions to be able to run 15.99 in the dead of summer.

He started with the ported plenums and spacers, TB and exhaust and those mods made him slower, it got progressively worse with head work and then just kept declining from there.

As I said earlier...
The trans work was done LAST as a last resort, it is NOT what made him slower. :deadhorse:

Honestly, "Dyno" numbers mean absolutely nothing to me, a dyno is performed under "controlled conditions" and is used to "tune the car" and seat of the pants feel on the street is deceiving and means nothing.

Real Life Performance Is Measured In The 1320'..

You can say "I did this and this and this and the dyno numbers were"...
SO...
All of that means nothing until you have the time slip in your hands showing what the mods did in "real life".

The only numbers that mattered to me and my Son were RT, 60', 1320' and Terminal Speed.
 

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Remember 1/4 mile times are not the only way to tell how quick a car is, nor do they represent how it feels on the street.
And all he was looking for was an increase in 1/4 mile ET, Nothing Else.

He wanted to run two classes at the track, Street and Pro.
Pro has a 15.99 cut so he needed to be able to run 15.99 under the worse conditions 90+ degrees with 80/90% humidity since he would not be able to dial higher than 15.99.

At the time the car was running 16.10 in good air conditions so we figured he would have to run 15.30 - 15.40 in good air conditions to be able to run 15.99 in the dead of summer.

He started with the ported plenums and spacers, TB and exhaust and those mods made him slower, it got progressively worse with head work and then just kept declining from there.

As I said earlier...
The trans work was done LAST as a last resort, it is NOT what made him slower.


Honestly, "Dyno" numbers mean absolutely nothing to me, a dyno is performed under "controlled conditions" and is used to "tune the car" and seat of the pants feel on the street is deceiving and means nothing.

Real Life Performance Is Measured In The 1320'..

You can say "I did this and this and this and the dyno numbers were"...
SO...
All of that means nothing until you have the time slip in your hands showing what the mods did in "real life".

The only numbers that mattered to me and my Son were RT, 60', 1320' and Terminal Speed.
If it makes you feel better Naj my new 1320 is 12.1 with my e85 tune on my 3.0 😎
 
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